Eredan's World

Nurvus · 01-05-2012 01:12:48

New Idea:

Old Idea:

Here's an idea for a Crow Card:
Works like [card]Narwhal[/card] or [card]Conquer or Perish[/card].
Performs the attack immediately, but you do not attack normally that Turn.
Without Tsume, Shadow Strike is much weaker, because you lose the Attack +2 from Tsume, and the magic attack equals your Min Attack instead of Max Attack.
Using a second Shadow Strike always uses your Min Attack because the first returns Tsume to your Hand.
Quick Comparison:
[card]Malyss[/card] playing [card]Rain of Death[/card]+[card]Vanish[/card] = 5-9 damage without conditions or bonuses.
When using Shadow Strike:
Toran the Regent (6-9) = 4 damage without Tsume, 9 with Tsume
Kotori Kage (7-9) = 5 damage without Tsume, 9 with Tsume
Karasu Kage (6-10) = 4 damage without Tsume, 10 with Tsume
---
Combos:
Yu Ling, Karasu Kage, Kotori Kage & Toran the Regent:
* (Tsume) Shadow Strike (Max Attack, Tsume back to Hand) -> [card]Vanish[/card]
* (Tsume) Shadow Strike (Max Attack, Tsume back to Hand) -> Shadow Strike (Min Attack)
Malyss, Yu Ling, Karasu Kage, Kotori Kage & Toran the Regent:
* (No Tsume) Shadow Strike (Min Attack) -> [card]Vanish[/card]
* (No Tsume) Shadow Strike (Min Attack) -> Shadow Strike (Min Attack)
Karasu Kage:
* Tsume -> Shadow Strike (Max Attack, Tsume back to Hand)
Karasu Kage & Kotori Kage:
* Shadow Strike -> Illumination (Shadow Strike or Shadow Master)
Kotori Kage (Turns 1, 2 and 4):
* Sens of Danger/Steel Body/Return to Sender -> Illumination (Shadow Strike) -> The Art of Tracking -> Shadow Strike (played by Illumination)

Dernière modification par Nurvus (01-06-2012 03:37:43)

Nurvus · 02-05-2012 23:40:12

So many replies!

Jachal · 03-05-2012 00:28:59

Seems cool to me. I am not a Crow player but this is some kind of improvement, especially combo with vanish, but I am not sure if damage from Shadow Strike would count or be denied. Anyway, good idea is good.

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 00:36:04

It would count.

skadooosh · 03-05-2012 00:43:48

combo with vanish is just too srong...
you deal your max attack and the opponent's attack just vanishes...
you cannot think this isn't over powered

Dernière modification par skadooosh (03-05-2012 00:45:45)

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 00:45:00

skadooosh a écrit :

combo with vanish is just too srong...
you deal your max attack and the opponent's attack just vanishes...
you cannot think this isn't over powered

To deal max attack you must have tsume.
If the opponent counters Shadow Strike tsume remains in your character and vanish fails as well.

skadooosh · 03-05-2012 00:49:48

...
you got three of that combo in your deck.
you don't need tsume to activate your spell, wich mean it won't always require to get discarded in order to play vanish.
I would nt have authorized it to chain or at least not into anything or only for mages, because it would really be too strong played by a marauder

Dernière modification par skadooosh (03-05-2012 00:50:48)

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 00:53:27

skadooosh a écrit :

...
you got three of that combo in your deck.
you don't need tsume to activate your spell, wich mean it won't always require to get discarded in order to play vanish.
I would nt have authorized it to chain or at least not into anything or only for mages, because it would really be too strong played by a marauder

Yes, but without Tsume you deal Min Attack instead.

So it's:
- a poor first fight combo
- a good second fight combo

Don't forget that in a "normal" crow deck, you'd be using stuff like Evil Eye (Attack +2) or other attack boosting effects INSTEAD of this+ vanish.

To play Shadow Strike + Vanish, you don't:
- reduce enemy spirit
- increase your attack

All you do is perform an unlucky hit (without tsume) or lucky hit (with tsume) and survive for 1 fight.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (03-05-2012 01:06:20)

Jachal · 03-05-2012 01:07:02

It's only OP when [card]Lucky Charm[/card] is placed on your character, otherwise it is standard.

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 01:08:25

Jachal a écrit :

It's only OP when [card]Lucky Charm[/card] is placed on your character, otherwise it is standard.

Again, that would require setup.

No different from setting up for a Narwhal+Conquer or Perish+Narwhal.

Imagine the opponent playing [card]Power of the Colossus[/card], Obesity, etc... every guild has stuff to screw this combo.
---

At this point I'm fairly positive you guys are only considering scenarios where the opponent has 0 Spirit or something...

You're disregarding the fact that you're not boosting your attack nor lowering enemy Spirit in order to play this combo.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (03-05-2012 01:11:12)

skadooosh · 03-05-2012 01:12:08

it's not because a combo can be broken that it's not cheated...
it's like saying wild buds is weak because everybody has anti permanent cards...

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 01:23:46

skadooosh a écrit :

it's not because a combo can be broken that it's not cheated...
it's like saying wild buds is weak because everybody has anti permanent cards...

(In short, I know the first instinct is that it's OP. But if you think about the current state of the Crow, and what you really accomplish with this combo, you'll realize it's not)

First, against casters, Shadow Strike + Vanish would prevent 1 spell on your Turn, or 0 spells on the enemy Turn.

Second, not all characters have 0 Spirit.
Those that have 0 Spirit usually have high Health (warriors) and have some form of healing or fancy one-shotting enemies.

Crow caste is weak atm.
Vanish is weak on its own, plus, if you play Tsume it becomes a trash card.
You got some decent combos but in the end the Caste underperforms.

Decent combos at the moment (for shadow guemelite/mage Crow):
- Time to Die + Karajutsu (as Toran)
- Tsume + Illumination>Shadow Master (as Karasu Kage)

Decent cards at the moment (for shadow guemelite/mage Crow):
- Sens of Danger / Steel Body
- Evil Eye
- Tsume / Mark of the Crow
- Secret of the Crow
- Shadow Master (useless against Temple Guardians/Compendium)
- Vanish (useless if you play Tsume)

Dernière modification par Nurvus (03-05-2012 01:27:05)

Jachal · 03-05-2012 08:19:26

Nurvus a écrit :

Again, that would require setup.
No different from setting up for a Narwhal+Conquer or Perish+Narwhal.
Imagine the opponent playing [card]Power of the Colossus[/card], Obesity, etc... every guild has stuff to screw this combo.
---
At this point I'm fairly positive you guys are only considering scenarios where the opponent has 0 Spirit or something...
You're disregarding the fact that you're not boosting your attack nor lowering enemy Spirit in order to play this combo.

Thank you Captain Obvious! Nothing offensive on my mind although I felt offended in this moment. Of course I considered that Vanish is action and can be easily countered with so many cards, but not every deck has them, and that not every character has spirit = 0, you tought I am stupid or maybe
Genius( http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2r97 … o1_400.png ) instead?

Opposing players has time to react in proper way to resist this combo, nothing special with it, I can even say it is even weak without few Karajutsu in play, and if your opponents just filled their decks with ridiculous Attack boosters then they can't grumble about it.

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 13:16:02

...My point is that Crow are too squishy if they go for high damage, or too weak if they play defensive.
This would give them some middle term.

If anything, maybe put a -1 or -2 in there or something.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (03-05-2012 17:28:18)

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 17:37:25

There, added a "-2" to the suggestion.

Jachal · 03-05-2012 18:06:46

- 2 Attack is making it rather weak becouse from beginning it's not good card against high Spirit characters, I would change it to Attack - X depending on your current Attack score, for example if your Attack is above 10 while playing this card your character have Attack - 1, when above 15: - 2 or even on the other hand, if your current Attack is lower than your printed Attack score your character gain Attack + 4

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 19:05:16

This isn't meant to be a "first turn kill" card.

First Turn, if you use Shadow Strike + Vanish you dealt minimal damage but avoided a potential one-shot, depending on the deck. You need to play smart.

If the opposing deck is offensive, it's a good call.
If the opposing deck is defensive, you are better off stacking Karajutsu.

Using [card]Karajutsu[/card] should be enough to make this card good.

Maybe another card could be added:
Spirit of the Crow
Kotoba - Item Jewel

Crow
+1 to Magic damage dealt and -1 to damage suffered.
Shadow Guemelite: Your character changes his appearance.
As this card activates and at the start of each fight, the opposing character has Spirit -1 until the end of the fight for each of your "Karajutsu" in play.
Permanent. Chain.

This would also make Shadow Master decent again.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (03-05-2012 19:21:44)

Jachal · 03-05-2012 20:36:32

Nurvus a écrit :

This isn't meant to be a "first turn kill" card.
First Turn, if you use Shadow Strike + Vanish you dealt minimal damage but avoided a potential one-shot, depending on the deck. You need to play smart.

Ok, let's imagine situation where you play Crows without Kotori Kage so you have:
Karasu Kage
Toran
Yu Ling

All of their minimum attack is 6, so after losing 2 attack what is left is 4 damage points, so even on a 0 spirit character it is crap, as they have tend to have a bit more health points, and they can play weapons and permanent cards.
So as I already said, it would be a lot better for this card to reduce attack when it is high, this is balance instead of making it kinda crap card. I really think some of your ideas are great, the idea of this card is great itself but the way you want to nerf it is wrong in my eyes. Anyway it's not like Feerik is going to release it so there is rather no point in arguing, it's your card and you can do with it whatever you like, can't wait for final result.

Dernière modification par Jachal (03-05-2012 20:37:45)

Nurvus · 03-05-2012 22:36:01

I see what you are saying, but I think the card must have flaws.

Playing it without attack buffs nor Tsume should be a no-no.
Playing it with attack buffs OR Tsume should be good.
Playing it with attack buffs AND Tsume should be great.

But yeah, maybe the -2 is unneeded.
I just thought it's better for the suggestion to be undertuned, otherwise ppl will always rage that it's OP

Dernière modification par Nurvus (03-05-2012 22:36:53)

Nurvus · 01-06-2012 03:26:33

I think the best way is to simply make this card deal Max Attack -2 all the time, and sending the Tsume to the deck is a way to both control your power (like double Shadow Strike) and allow Vanish to work.

Eredan's World

Annonce

#1 01-05-2012 01:12:48

New Crow Card

#2 02-05-2012 23:40:12

Re : New Crow Card

#3 03-05-2012 00:28:59

Re : New Crow Card

#4 03-05-2012 00:36:04

Re : New Crow Card

#5 03-05-2012 00:43:48

Re : New Crow Card

#6 03-05-2012 00:45:00

Re : New Crow Card

#7 03-05-2012 00:49:48

Re : New Crow Card

#8 03-05-2012 00:53:27

Re : New Crow Card

#9 03-05-2012 01:07:02

Re : New Crow Card

#10 03-05-2012 01:08:25

Re : New Crow Card

#11 03-05-2012 01:12:08

Re : New Crow Card

#12 03-05-2012 01:23:46

Re : New Crow Card

#13 03-05-2012 08:19:26

Re : New Crow Card

#14 03-05-2012 13:16:02

Re : New Crow Card

#15 03-05-2012 17:37:25

Re : New Crow Card

#16 03-05-2012 18:06:46

Re : New Crow Card

#17 03-05-2012 19:05:16

Re : New Crow Card

#18 03-05-2012 20:36:32

Re : New Crow Card

#19 03-05-2012 22:36:01

Re : New Crow Card

#20 01-06-2012 03:26:33

Re : New Crow Card

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