Eredan's World

jackal19 · 24-07-2011 04:34:21

Well seeing and hearing those annoying priest decks with two ans and a void i got an idea that a legend limitation in all decks should be made or legends should be banned in elo altogether feel free to post your comments just be civilized

Should all decks have a one legend limit

Yes
No
Or all legends should be banned in elo instead

Votes totaux: 44

Les résultats du sondage sont masqués pour les invités

Dernière modification par jackal19 (24-07-2011 10:18:13)

goscar · 24-07-2011 04:36:29

Meh I say let the scrubs keep at least one legendary in their deck.

Reycom · 24-07-2011 09:27:56

( same as my comment in an other topic )

If you ask me , i'll say :

- Make [card]A New Start[/card] Unique
- Ban [card]The Prestige[/card] and [card]The Hungry Void[/card] 1-2 weeks every month
- Ban Discard Deck 1-2 weeks every month

So finally people can play in elo without have legendary cards cause these cards make a lot of difference.
The legendary cards are too much expensive and if we continue in this way only rich people will go on the top of the elo .... and that is annoying ......

Nurvus · 25-07-2011 04:05:34

I like the idea of having a "X Legendary per Deck" limit.
- 1 Legendary per deck may be too harsh
- 2 Legendary per deck seems acceptable
- 3 Legendary per deck might end up being fairest

I think I have an even better idea - Elite cards!

- Each deck can only have 3 Elite cards.

How is this different from limiting a deck to X Legendary cards?
Some Legendaries - but not necessarily all - can be Elite, and as such "share" a spot with other Elite cards in a deck, thus limiting the deck's potential overpoweredness.

How does this fix anything?
Let's imagine [card]The Prestige[/card], [card]Mental Syphon[/card], [card]Treacherous[/card] and [card]Theft[/card] are considered too powerful when together in the same deck.
Instead of banning any of them, what if The Prestige, Mental Syphon and Treacherous are branded Elite? The Prestige and Mental Syphon are Unique, so this means you can have:
- 1 The Prestige + 1 Mental Syphon + 1 Treacherous + 3 Theft
- 1 The Prestige + 2 Treacherous + 3 Theft
- 1 Mental Syphon + 2 Treacherous + 3 Theft
- 3 Treacherous + 3 Theft

What if instead Theft and Treacherous are the only ones branded Elite? This means you can have:
- 1 The Prestige + 1 Mental Syphon + 3 Treacherous
- 1 The Prestige + 1 Mental Syphon + 2 Treacherous + 1 Theft
- 1 The Prestige + 1 Mental Syphon + 1 Treacherous + 2 Theft
- 1 The Prestige + 1 Mental Syphon + 3 Theft

This is just hypotetically speaking.
The bottom line is that it allows Feerik to "ban/limit/weaken certain op combos" without banning cards and instead creating a system that limits how many OP cards are put together in the same deck.

* Make A New Start unique.
* Nerf The Prestige to a 2 card removal (instead of 3).

Periodically Allowed OP cards?
As I've always defended, banning certain cards but allowing their periodical use is, in my opinion, a design I will no longer adjectivate, as it would inevitably insult whoever suggests it.

Goal?
The purpose of Feerik should be making all cards useable, viable and valid.
- If it means creating counter cards, so be it, but it risks breaking current decks in the process as not all decks can afford to sacrifice deck spots for counters.
- If it means changing certain cards considered overpowered or underpowered, so be it, and personally I believe it is the best way

Permanent Card Bans?
If Feerik ever decides to permaban a card instead of "fixing it", it means Feerik is willing to disregard the effort and investment players make in acquiring cards, specially Legendary cards, and as such alot of players, me included, would stop giving Feerik's design any credit whatsoever, and leave.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (25-07-2011 04:38:53)

goscar · 25-07-2011 07:05:25

Nurvus a écrit :

Alot

Or we can limit how many legends ppl can have in their decks to 1 and keep banning other things. :3

Riversilk · 26-07-2011 09:43:59

Reycom a écrit :

The legendary cards are too much expensive and if we continue in this way only rich people will go on the top of the elo .... and that is annoying ......

It's already like this.

Reycom · 26-07-2011 09:47:34

Riversilk a écrit :

Reycom a écrit :
The legendary cards are too much expensive and if we continue in this way only rich people will go on the top of the elo .... and that is annoying ......
It's already like this.

I know ..... and this is sad

al_vh1n · 26-07-2011 10:27:21

The problem here is not about how many legendary cards should be allowed in elo or what cards should be banned. I think it is the lack of tournaments that players can participate in. I mean elo is the tourney that only the best (or richest) players can compete to see who has the best deck . That's fine w/ me. But what about those who are still starting or those who can't afford yet those expensive cards. They can’t compete in elo against them and they will be eaten alive there.

So how about make a different tournament that bans these legendaries and uber strong/expensive cards (3-5 in each guild and 5-10 non-affiliated) or other restrictions. This way players can test their strategic and deck building skills rather than relying on these op cards.

Lets face it feerik won't ban those expensive cards in elo since those cards bring a lot of cash in their bank accounts. But maybe make a tourney that everyone can participate and even have a chance of winning. Coz on the looks of it, elo only makes strong players even more stronger.

JarodG64 · 26-07-2011 10:31:32

Also a tournament where only level 1 characters are allowed could be a way to give a better chance to low level players.

Nurvus · 26-07-2011 21:46:31

goscar a écrit :

Nurvus a écrit :
Alot
Or we can limit how many legends ppl can have in their decks to 1 and apply your Elite card system as well. :3

Fixed. :3

Dernière modification par Nurvus (26-07-2011 21:47:33)

goscar · 27-07-2011 03:37:04

Nurvus a écrit :

goscar a écrit :
Nurvus a écrit :
Alot
Or we can limit how many legends ppl can have in their decks to 1 and apply your Elite card system as well. :3
Fixed. :3

Indeed! ;3

Ryken · 27-07-2011 08:37:21

I see much crying.

Ha.

goscar · 27-07-2011 13:11:16

Ryken a écrit :

I see much crying.
Ha.

Yup...
I also don't like time wasters. cough cough :3

http://forum.eredan.com/viewtopic.php?id=14985

Dernière modification par goscar (27-07-2011 13:25:55)

jackal19 · 27-07-2011 13:22:16

Ryken a écrit :

I see much crying.
Ha.

Crying? cmon looks like you dont do much huh? Ha yourself sassafras and if your going to troll pls do it somewhere else

Dernière modification par jackal19 (27-07-2011 13:50:04)

Ryken · 27-07-2011 16:13:58

goscar a écrit :

Ryken a écrit :
I see much crying.
Ha.
Yup...
I also don't like time wasters. cough cough :3
http://forum.eredan.com/viewtopic.php?id=14985

That doesn't make sense in the context of this topic. The fact that you dug up a topic from last year is utterly pathetic. Try harder.

jackal19 a écrit :

Ryken a écrit :
I see much crying.
Ha.
Crying? cmon looks like you dont do much huh? Ha yourself sassafras and if your going to troll pls do it somewhere else

This also doesn't make sense in the context of this topic. Fail.

If Legendary Cards were THAT much of a problem, wouldn't they be banned in the only format that matters; ELO? Oh, look...Ishaia is banned. Are ANY other cards that much of a problem? No. You don't see them because they're hard to pull or are too damn expensive.

I've seen decks based around 3 legendary characters. Why would it be fair if they can't run more if Legendary Cards are limited to 3? Or NOT be able to run that deck if they were limited to one? or have 1 (or three, or two even) Legendary Cards in their deck and not be able to run the characters they want?

No way around it. The reason I said I see much crying is because that's all this is; a cry fest. Ishaia is already banned because of whiners and criers. So are Discard Decks. I've seen this on MMOs and many other games, where enough pissing and moaning will get these people what they want.

So please, keep going. Cry more. Limit Legendary Cards, despite not being that much of a problem in the first place. If people are willing to buy packs/save up enough to get the cards they want off the marketplace, let them do so. Don't punish them or playing/paying for your game.

jackal19 a écrit :

Well seeing and hearing those annoying priest decks with two ans and a void i got an idea that a legend limitation in all decks should be made or legends should be banned in elo altogether feel free to post your comments just be civilized

As it is, the reason this topic was created was because one person heard/got beat by a deck with 2 ANS and a Void. Yeah, that's a good reason to make a topic like this.

EDIT: Though I DO agree ANS should be Unique. Why isn't it?

Dernière modification par Ryken (27-07-2011 16:17:55)

goscar · 27-07-2011 16:58:50

Ryken a écrit :

goscar a écrit :
Ryken a écrit :
I see much crying.
Ha.
Yup...
I also don't like time wasters. cough cough :3
http://forum.eredan.com/viewtopic.php?id=14985
That doesn't make sense in the context of this topic. The fact that you dug up a topic from last year is utterly pathetic. Try harder.

LOL trying! Took me a second to find your sad thread.

Either way the reason this thread was made cause in chat we were discussing how basically all the Legendaries are OP and how there should be a way to limit that.

Ryken · 27-07-2011 17:31:19

goscar a écrit :

Ryken a écrit :
goscar a écrit :
Yup...
I also don't like time wasters. cough cough :3
http://forum.eredan.com/viewtopic.php?id=14985
That doesn't make sense in the context of this topic. The fact that you dug up a topic from last year is utterly pathetic. Try harder.
LOL trying! Took me a second to find your sad thread.
Either way the reason this thread was made cause in chat we were discussing how basically all the Legendaries are OP and how there should be a way to limit that.

Yeah, okay. Whatever makes you feel like a man goscar. You need all the help you can get.

And not ALL Legendary cards are OP. If you had half a brain, which I doubt, you'd see that. In fact, how many Legendary Cards have you seen mentioned in this thread? ANS? Prestige? Void? Oh yeah, that's a GREAT representation of all the Legendary cards this game has.

I mentioned Ishaia, which, quite frankly, is more of a problem because of her combo with Ice Barrier (outside that, she's still a great card). No one's mentioned banner, Foam Giant, Sveylath, Mastery, Antimagic Glyph (Not unique!), Stone-Heart...anything.

So don't come at me with your crap when you're literally discussing THREE cards.

Rathedan · 27-07-2011 18:39:39

Stop feeding the fire guys or this gets locked down.

What started as a good discussion is getting to be a troll fest.

A) Don't belittle others, don't "QQ maor n00b" attack, don't troll in general (Looking at you Ryken)

B) Don't call others sad/pathetic and counterattack (goscar)

Keep civil or the thread'll not be open anymore, which would be sad because both sides actually have valid points. If it's a continuation of one individual after warning and the thread otherwise is civil, expect repercussions.

Nurvus · 27-07-2011 22:15:05

Read my suggestion near the top of the topic again so you can understand better what I'm talking about.

1 - I'm against banning cards. It's an insult to players' investment and creativity.
2 - I want the focus to be on fixing balance. It may require additional systems.
3 - Legendary cards are very powerful and them being very expensive is unfair to competitiveness - where in most decks, having them or not is truly a matter of winning or losing.
4 - The suggestion of limiting Legendaries to 1 may work out; perhaps 2 or 3 would also work out.
5 - My suggestion of Elite cards would reduce the need to limit Legendaries, because some times it's not the legendaries alone, but certain combos they participate in.
Elite cards would be groups of cards considered too dangerous to have in the same deck in full quantity. This -might- (just hypotetically) be the case of Treacherous + Theft + The Prestige + Panic, therefore possibly branding treacherous + theft or treacherous + panic or theft + panic as elite, limiting u to a total of 3 among the 2 different cards.

My goal? NOT shutting down deck ideas, and instead managing their OPness with a solid system.

GKZhukov · 27-07-2011 23:08:16

I like the Elite idea.

Most of the "problem" cards are problematic in large numbers/combos so having a limit of X elite cards could be very effective at both allowing those poor banned cards to see *some* action and at the same time restoring an overall balance (there would be other currently unbanned cards which I imagine would also make such a list and the list would have to be well constructed and periodically reviewed).

I also like the Format idea.

Perhaps different tournament/league formats would have different "Elite" lists (and the more budget/newbie friendly ones would potentially still incorporate some sort of ban list too or else a more rigorous elite list).

I actually agree with Nurvus when he says he's not shutting down deck ideas. If anything I think it will open them up. Take his example of treacherous, prestige, theft etc. different people would then start choosing different combinations to take up the 3 slots they'd be allowed. Some might start taking their decks in completely different directions, and there probably wouldn't be one stand out brainless power option.

Nurvus · 28-07-2011 02:51:33

Elite would be(*) like Unique or Legendary - a card stat, rather than something like Banned that doesn't show on a card(*).
Some Legendaries might be Elite.

No need for a list, nor format list.

Banning is bad. Trust me.

(*) EDITED.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (31-07-2011 15:02:22)

magius · 28-07-2011 09:39:22

Nurvus a écrit :

Elite would like Unique or Legendary - a card stat.
Some Legendaries might be Elite.
No need for a list, nor format list.
Banning is bad. Trust me.

From what I can see... the best solution is by dividing the rooms into these distinction:
1) Elite-rank ELO Tournament: High rewards. Format Restriction applies for balancing.

2) Advance-rank ELO Tournament: Medium rewards. No Legendary cards allowed. Format restriction applies.

3) Theme Tournament: Low rewards. Fun based format (level 1 cards only, etc.). Non-ELO.

4) Casual room: similar to level room. Some rewards, some XP.

5) Training Room: No rewards, high XP.

Ryken · 28-07-2011 12:37:13

I'm against banning as well, but if you read my previous post you'll see I pointed out that there are really only a few Legendary Cards that people are complaining about. I don't know the exact number of Legendary cards out there, but why do ANYTHING with them when it's really just a few problem cards? Limiting the amount of Legendary cards someone has in their deck is a mistake should it come to pass. I mean, would it be limited to cards, or characters as well? If you play Foam Giant, can you have no other Legendary cards? That's be a kick to the nuts.

Make all Legendaries Unique. Why ANS isn't is beyond me. But if someone wants their deck filled to the brim with Legendary cards, let them. It doesn't mean it'll tear every OTHER deck apart just because a FEW SELECT CARDS are what people are REALLY complaining about. It just means he/she spent more time/money on it.

jackal19 · 28-07-2011 12:46:00

Yes do that and elo will be for the almighty legends forever so much for competition also they're legends for godsakes why do you have so to put so many to make a good deck if you want to play unlimited legends do it in the level room not for elo cause elo is turning into a joke with this unlimited legend stupidity i rather take nurvus suggestion which is better imo. oh yeah for the foamy part you can play it without other legends duh XD

Dernière modification par jackal19 (28-07-2011 13:02:22)

Nurvus · 28-07-2011 18:42:30

Ryken a écrit :

I'm against banning as well, but if you read my previous post you'll see I pointed out that there are really only a few Legendary Cards that people are complaining about. I don't know the exact number of Legendary cards out there, but why do ANYTHING with them when it's really just a few problem cards? Limiting the amount of Legendary cards someone has in their deck is a mistake should it come to pass. I mean, would it be limited to cards, or characters as well? If you play Foam Giant, can you have no other Legendary cards? That's be a kick to the nuts.
Make all Legendaries Unique. Why ANS isn't is beyond me. But if someone wants their deck filled to the brim with Legendary cards, let them. It doesn't mean it'll tear every OTHER deck apart just because a FEW SELECT CARDS are what people are REALLY complaining about. It just means he/she spent more time/money on it.

A New Start for example, is only "OP" because Discard decks are OP, and Discard decks are OP because of the extremely synergic and nearly uncounterable combination of cards they use.

Restricting the OPness of the discard deck by reducing the total amount of "OP cards" in it (instead of banning stuff), through the Elite suggestion, in turn makes A New Start less mandatory/powerful, wich in turn makes it less necessary to be nerfed/banned/made unique.

In all cases it's a snowball of OPness, rather than a single card at fault.

A New Start is OP because it counters something OP - fix the later and ANS isn't OP anymore.

Dernière modification par Nurvus (01-08-2011 20:12:24)

Eredan's World

Annonce

#1 24-07-2011 04:34:21

Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#2 24-07-2011 04:36:29

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#3 24-07-2011 09:27:56

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#4 25-07-2011 04:05:34

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#5 25-07-2011 07:05:25

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#6 26-07-2011 09:43:59

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#7 26-07-2011 09:47:34

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#8 26-07-2011 10:27:21

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#9 26-07-2011 10:31:32

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#10 26-07-2011 21:46:31

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#11 27-07-2011 03:37:04

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#12 27-07-2011 08:37:21

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#13 27-07-2011 13:11:16

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#14 27-07-2011 13:22:16

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#15 27-07-2011 16:13:58

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#16 27-07-2011 16:58:50

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#17 27-07-2011 17:31:19

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#18 27-07-2011 18:39:39

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#19 27-07-2011 22:15:05

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#20 27-07-2011 23:08:16

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#21 28-07-2011 02:51:33

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#22 28-07-2011 09:39:22

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#23 28-07-2011 12:37:13

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#24 28-07-2011 12:46:00

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

#25 28-07-2011 18:42:30

Re : Legends should be one per deck only or ban them in elo altogether

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