The witchblades ends being nearly useless as theres nearly no chains in the deck meaning she can only play 1 card per fight, and the only chain is brutaly random theres alot more usefull cards, having a single burn in a hell makes it a totaly useless card, almost no build up cards ( itens, permant spells) means after the start we get outgunned hard.

If you lads need some ideias that wont OP the crap out of the deck but help «make it more playable just ask, i got a few

scorvos74 · 05-07-2012 20:19:14

The starter decks are really there to give new players the flavor of each Guild; and Noz is kind of schizophrenia that way.

Noz Mage, Compendium, WitchBlade and Dragon Knights all have very different play style (the same could be said for other guilds... but Noz seems to have this is spades)

Calandra · 05-07-2012 20:46:56

scorvos74 a écrit :

The starter decks are really there to give new players the flavor of each Guild; and Noz is kind of schizophrenia that way.
Noz Mage, Compendium, WitchBlade and Dragon Knights all have very different play style (the same could be said for other guilds... but Noz seems to have this is spades)

that was what i tried to say as well.... and i dont fully understand why mercs are supposed to be a guild by themselves but are mixed in many others..

ye the 3 old starter decks were having mercs but back then the mercs didnt play any big role and were far from being a guild...

nowadays the mercs are good enough to at least pretend being a guild (with castes) and the other 6 real guilds (not talking about nehantists) dont need mercs anymore

and well ye noz cought the bad end of that line no? i can just judge from my experience of playing against noz and also from seeing their decklist... maybe someone who plays noz could say how good they work and against whom

Damncaster · 05-07-2012 21:07:29

Sapphon a écrit :

sMuuth a écrit :
New:
So the old one will be deleted and replaced?
I mean the 3 starter(with cx) before.
That's right. And of course players who bought the old ones will be able to buy the new ones.

Thanks a lot for giving away assassinations, wakizashis and crickets... as for the noz i really liek the idea of a new fireball xD

magius · 05-07-2012 22:02:32

Noz unfortunately lose out on points. The spells are just not good enough to kill . Who would put just 1 Burn in Hell in this deck??? XD I rather have another Combustion

Dernière modification par magius (05-07-2012 22:02:50)

sMuuth · 05-07-2012 23:04:31

Sapphon a écrit :

sMuuth a écrit :
New:
So the old one will be deleted and replaced?
I mean the 3 starter(with cx) before.
That's right. And of course players who bought the old ones will be able to buy the new ones.

Thanks Sapphon

Burghi · 05-07-2012 23:45:59

when the new decks will be available to buy?

Sapphon · 06-07-2012 11:30:48

We'll make some changes on some starters before the second tournament. These starters will be Noz, Sap Heart and Nomades.
I'll give you the details as soon as I get them.

Burghi a écrit :

when the new decks will be available to buy?

As I said earlier on the same page : yes ;p

magius · 06-07-2012 11:49:08

Sapphon a écrit :

We'll make some changes on some starters before the second tournament. These starters will be Noz, Sap Heart and Nomades.
I'll give you the details as soon as I get them.
Burghi a écrit :
when the new decks will be available to buy?
As I said earlier on the same page : yes ;p

Yay! Looking forward to Noz one I'll re-test it for the second tourney. Gave up on the first one as the outlook is always grim.

Dhaonrisemlan · 06-07-2012 12:05:53

All I am going to say right now is that the highest ranked Noz deck is ranked 268... Thats all.

Sapphon · 06-07-2012 15:02:29

Here is the detail of the modification we'll be doing to the Noz, Sap Heart and Nomad starter for the next tournament :

Noz :

[card]The Pythia[/card] is replaced by [card]Pilkim[/card]
[card]Burn in Hell[/card] is replaced by [card]Magic Attack[/card]
[card]Sylphide[/card] is replaced by [card]Combustion[/card]
[card]Implosion[/card] is replaced by [card]Combustion[/card]

Nomads :

[card]The Annunciator[/card] is replaced by [card]Lady Jane[/card]
[card]Divine Intervention[/card] is replaced by [card]...to Face[/card]
[card]Insolation[/card] is replaced by [card]Basking in the Sun[/card]
[card]Moneyed[/card] is replaced by [card]Solar Plastron[/card]

Sap Hearts :

[card]Aez the Wandering Warrior[/card] is replaced by [card]Hares the Brute[/card]
[card]Deirf Geis's Shield[/card] is replaced by [card]Runic Gauntlet[/card]
[card]Flail[/card] is replaced by [card]Simple Dagger[/card]

steeliebob · 06-07-2012 15:34:08

I like the updates. Noz really needed the little extra fire power.
and for the nomads, solar plastron and basking in the sun are nice.

nemoutopia · 06-07-2012 17:35:44

This a great tournament, and I'm only sad I haven't had the chance to join in the first of the set! Really like that you guys are tweaking the decks based on results from the tournament as well.

TheRainMan · 06-07-2012 18:24:18

Sapphon a écrit :

sMuuth a écrit :
New:
So the old one will be deleted and replaced?
I mean the 3 starter(with cx) before.
That's right. And of course players who bought the old ones will be able to buy the new ones.

So 2 assassinate for nothing? Nice <3

steeliebob · 06-07-2012 18:36:17

TheRainMan a écrit :

So 2 assassinate for nothing? Nice <3

I have the one from the zil start, one with an alternate artwork from some event ( i think it was a Eredan birthday booster or something) and the last one will be from the new zill starter.

Dernière modification par steeliebob (06-07-2012 18:36:29)

rulerdragon · 06-07-2012 21:54:34

Nice changes to the noz, the deck would still like some chains for the poor witchblade tho! still will retry next tournament the deck

P.S. btw if possible add a way to see rating seperated per decks

Dernière modification par rulerdragon (06-07-2012 22:26:50)

vampiricshaman · 07-07-2012 04:22:35

Sapphon a écrit :

Noz :
[card]Implosion[/card] is replaced by [card]Combustion[/card]

is that both implosion or just one

nemoutopia · 07-07-2012 05:00:47

Zurga a écrit :

Runic is a difficult mechanic with the rune.
A deck with no rune won't work and you need to have access to the adventure mode to gain some runes.
So difficult at this time to create a Runic starter.

Fail, and this is not the reason. Either have the starter contain specific upgraded versions that are chosen to make the deck playable, or X amount of Cor and Y amount of Nox included with the deck itself (so that after you get xp on the cards, you have the runes) and allow the player to decide from multi-pathed upgrades. Peace/War, War Cry, Runic Power, Ceremonial, and Blessing of the Pantheon are all commons that provide Rune interactions and would allow for either chose of rune-granting. So, what's the REAL reason? Those cards, along with just about any of their uncommons, are ahead of the power-curve that is currently acceptable in starters. A SINGLE Runic Power might be acceptable in the deck, along with a single Peace/War combo and a Ceremonial. But anything that consumes Runes comes out too far ahead, and card-recycling isn't something that looks acceptable in a starter deck. So it came down to a bunch of bad choices, the least evil of which was to simply leave them out.

Each one has his preferred guilds and some decks will seem more powerful than others.
But be sure that all decks have somehow the same chance to win against any other deck.
They are starters, they are not good, optimised ones, the characters will stay level one.
Don't except miracles but don't be so sure that one of them will rules on all others.

&

As far as I know, the Noz are only weak because you don't play them.
They are the same chances as others.

I only respect opinions that come from the same reality the players exist in. When one deck has a particularly high loss ratio compared to the others, and has easily identifiable problems that keep it from being as competitive, there is a gap between ideal and reality. Guess how far down the Elo list in the tournament you have to go to find a Noz deck? Currently searching, and I find the first one at position ~435, with less than 10 games played. Oh sorry, he lost a game and dropped, the next comes in at ~485...also with less than 10 games played. Any Noz that has played more than 10 games is relegated to barely above 1500 Elo, or worse than rank 750. I realize that part of the reason for running these tournaments IS to tweak the balance, but seriously! I'm not arguing that the Noz are THE weakest, since other guilds are currently facing similar woes, but they are clearly on the low tier of the current balancing act.

Oh, and if the actual performance of the deck wasn't proof enough, here's the current problem set:
-Sylphide can only be played by Pythia, activates at the end of the turn, and does not chain.
-Eglantyne has exactly two chaining options: Double or Quit, which can backfire horrifically, and the SPECIFIC combination of Pen -> Sword.
-Scepter of the Border activates at the end of the fight and does not chain. Congratulations only allowing one to two points of healing in a typical match!
-Burn In Hell only makes sense if there is another one in the deck...it is actually WEAKER than including another Smoked Arrow (or almost any other damaging spell).
-Illusory Reflection is incredibly weak in this deck, contrary to its typical play.

The changes listed by Sapphon are strong improvements to each deck that should help keep them competing better, and address two of the three issues above. Illusory Reflection should still be replaced by another card (even more Fog or Martial Magic!). Are Power and Temporal Paradox excluded because of Act restrictions? They are both commons that have been around for a while and would up the power of the deck.

Zurga, I love you. But you have to be honest with yourself if you have any chance of being honest with us.

iQuit · 07-07-2012 05:23:10

Runic deck is not possible because it highly depends on its guild cards .

nemoutopia · 07-07-2012 08:22:47

iQuit a écrit :

Runic deck is not possible because it highly depends on its guild cards .

Hogwash and balderdash, gentle sir. Runic Warriors could be comparable to the current mercenary deck using completely unaffiliated cards.

Calandra · 07-07-2012 10:54:06

nemoutopia a écrit :

iQuit a écrit :
Runic deck is not possible because it highly depends on its guild cards .
Hogwash and balderdash, gentle sir. Runic Warriors could be comparable to the current mercenary deck using completely unaffiliated cards.

and they would even make more sense then mercs in the tournament... mercs either are a guild for themselves or not... but so far there has not been an official statement about that...

like last event dark vs light ... mercs were not included... that tells me they are not seen as a guild on their own by the staff

this tournament they suddently are?! where is the logic? they are just fillers for gaps that occur every now and then... so is there gameplay... thats why i dont understand their involvment in other guilds in this tournament while being on the way to establish themselves as guild... it just occurs a bit strange to me

Zurga · 07-07-2012 12:08:49

nemoutopia a écrit :

Zurga, I love you. But you have to be honest with yourself if you have any chance of being honest with us.

I answer with the information I have.
For the deck Noz, there was some changes with the first version discussed.
I wasn't aware of these.

I have always said that I give you information as I have them, I never said that I have all the answers.
You seem knowing all the answers, I don't have them.
Now, as I'm a liar and not honest, I don't see any reason to continue this discussion.

Eredan's World

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