But there is a lot of other like Arkalor effect, Longevity for Immortals, there is that one with the lil ladie on it (moneyed i think), there one for Ice elves that return cards, there is one for Noz WB.. In all, all guilds with high spirit got some anti-discard cards. I think the only one who don't is kotoba, but they don't need to spam cards to kill so they are probally fine. And these are only the example that came in to my mind.. There are more.

Calandra · 20-02-2012 11:55:52

like all the cards that come back into deck or on hand after being used... we already got 2 of em by trophy... origami i think is one for kotoba

Leorio · 20-02-2012 12:01:13

Discard decks also contain damage cards, ya know =p
I run avalon, so I know there's anti-discards, but they commonly get..well..discarded by effects.

Gent M · 20-02-2012 16:55:35

@leorio
I guess you haven't heard of Marauders Nehant, Zil and Pirates - they all have the ability to kill one or more enemies in the first 3 turns easily. Never heard of players running one of those decks complain about discard.

When you have more experience at the game you might come to understand the extremely important role discard has in ELO in terms of maintaining a certain degree of variety.

Santuros · 20-02-2012 18:09:39

Gent M a écrit :

@leorio
I guess you haven't heard of Marauders Nehant, Zil and Pirates - they all have the ability to kill one or more enemies in the first 3 turns easily. Never heard of players running one of those decks complain about discard.
When you have more experience at the game you might come to understand the extremely important role discard has in ELO in terms of maintaining a certain degree of variety.

True! Pirates role all over their faces! Plus feerik has been implementing new cards that once used return to your deck, or other recycling cards... so its no big deal. I believe in a close future they should not be that much of a problem.

Paladino.:RR:. · 20-02-2012 18:14:25

Beside, all the later releases for Zil, did not focus on purely discard, but more like a mill deck. Or agressive priests...

Leorio · 21-02-2012 06:02:16

Things to keep in mind vs a discard-focused deck-

You will have no discard pile.

Your cards will be discarded from every single source possible.

All your cards, except those attached to your characters, are useless.

Norad IV · 26-02-2012 05:17:07

Leorio a écrit :

Increase the deck size to 30 cards. Problem solved.
Discard decks take skill to survive past turn 6...no skill whatsoever before then.

I have stated and started multiple threads about this many times. Feerik does not respond, instead we get people who play discards who say to shut up and grow up. The fact is discards do not belong in this game. I feel your pain and believe eredan would be 100x better without discards.

Of course that means "weapons at will" and "items have a soul" would have to be unique.

Then it gets interesting.

Calandra · 26-02-2012 08:23:46

Norad IV a écrit :

instead we get people who play discards who say to shut up and grow up.

+1 to what the ppl say

JarodG64 · 26-02-2012 10:46:03

Leorio a écrit :

How to fix discard decks.

I didn't know they needed fixing. I was under the impression that they work just fine as they are.

Leorio a écrit :

Increase the deck size to 30 cards. Problem solved.
Discard decks take skill to survive past turn 6...no skill whatsoever before then.

Ah OK now I understand. You don't want to fix a problem with discard decks you want to fix what you think is a problem in general i.e. playing discard. You're one of these discard haters.
Don't you think that the problem is that YOU don't have enough skills to survive a discard deck ?

Fulbert · 26-02-2012 17:09:47

To be honest I play discard decks and I do win most of the time in PvP but when it's in Elo I lose a lot of games.
For me, there are 3 factors to winning a game in Eredan itcg:
- Luck
-Cards in your Deck
-Experience
Thanks for understanding my point of view

Leorio · 26-02-2012 17:59:47

Cards in deck=90% -3 copy limit makes it very easy to pull any card you need with a minimum of 1/3 chance, main reason most card games require 40 card deck minimums..that and money.

Luck=7%. -Cards your opponent draws, random d/cs. Luck really has very little impact on most decks, as they spam the same basic attacks, be they discard, negation, healing, or just heavy damage, over and over.

Experience=3% - All but the dumbest of the fools can use most decks with a basic understanding. Only foreseeable problem is some people can't read properly, or the game doesn't support their primary language.

A real discard deck...not the wannabe nub decks you commonly see...is nigh-unbeatable. The only things I can see beating it are 20+ atk value first turn decks. So...Abom or Kotoba. Of course, discard decks wreak havoc on other discard decks. That's a given.
After playing a thousand matches against varying deck types, the only deck that I could see no foreseeable way of beating with my decks was a pure caster Zil discard+eliminate deck. Their def stayed above 6 every fight, healed for 5 or more every fight, and both discarded from hand and deck, as well as immediately removing discarded cards from play. Then, right before they ran out of cards...they played a new start.
The issue is more of the fact that discard characters are incredibly easy to obtain, and their spells don't cost much either. If it actually cost a lot to make the deck, people would deserve their wins. As it stands, a simple kotoba weapons at will deck costs more to maximize.

Leorio · 26-02-2012 18:31:36

And just so you know, this is how most of my fights end vs scrub (bandwagon players) discard decks.

Santuros · 26-02-2012 18:36:17

Leorio a écrit :

Cards in deck=90% -3 copy limit makes it very easy to pull any card you need with a minimum of 1/3 chance, main reason most card games require 40 card deck minimums..that and money.
Luck=7%. -Cards your opponent draws, random d/cs. Luck really has very little impact on most decks, as they spam the same basic attacks, be they discard, negation, healing, or just heavy damage, over and over.
Experience=3% - All but the dumbest of the fools can use most decks with a basic understanding. Only foreseeable problem is some people can't read properly, or the game doesn't support their primary language.
A real discard deck...not the wannabe nub decks you commonly see...is nigh-unbeatable. The only things I can see beating it are 20+ atk value first turn decks. So...Abom or Kotoba. Of course, discard decks wreak havoc on other discard decks. That's a given.
After playing a thousand matches against varying deck types, the only deck that I could see no foreseeable way of beating with my decks was a pure caster Zil discard+eliminate deck. Their def stayed above 6 every fight, healed for 5 or more every fight, and both discarded from hand and deck, as well as immediately removing discarded cards from play. Then, right before they ran out of cards...they played a new start.
The issue is more of the fact that discard characters are incredibly easy to obtain, and their spells don't cost much either. If it actually cost a lot to make the deck, people would deserve their wins. As it stands, a simple kotoba weapons at will deck costs more to maximize.

I beg to differ about experience and knowledge, may be you can know how to use a deck, but since you confront different enemies you must know their strategy to... for example one does not simply use an action while the marauder pirates has the turn...or you should reserve the defense='0 cards for the late games if you face shadow mages, when they use defense buffs. id give experience a value of 20%

Dernière modification par Santuros (26-02-2012 18:37:14)

Leorio · 26-02-2012 18:50:13

Good point. I was counting knowing when to use the cards in your deck as part of their slice of the pie, but I guess it would make more sense counting it under experience as opposed to assuming people know how to use the cards they put in their deck. Take 17% off the cards and throw it onto experience, maybe?

TPPK · 26-02-2012 21:56:29

I didn't read anything in this thread.

OP, play a discard deck yourself to learn how pathetically weak they are.

Dernière modification par TPPK (26-02-2012 21:56:41)

Calandra · 27-02-2012 00:22:11

Leorio a écrit :

A real discard deck...not the wannabe nub decks you commonly see...is nigh-unbeatable. The only things I can see beating it are 20+ atk value first turn decks. So...Abom or Kotoba. Of course, discard decks wreak havoc on other discard decks. That's a given.
After playing a thousand matches against varying deck types, the only deck that I could see no foreseeable way of beating with my decks was a pure caster Zil discard+eliminate deck. Their def stayed above 6 every fight, healed for 5 or more every fight, and both discarded from hand and deck, as well as immediately removing discarded cards from play. Then, right before they ran out of cards...they played a new start.
The issue is more of the fact that discard characters are incredibly easy to obtain, and their spells don't cost much either. If it actually cost a lot to make the deck, people would deserve their wins. As it stands, a simple kotoba weapons at will deck costs more to maximize.

as your wisdom is so vast and amazing that i want to bath in it, could you please while granting us normal beings the pleasure of your presence in any room that feerik provides for our unworthy battles, write down what exactly these filthy villians that dare to use this incredibly bad discard-style got in their decks?
i m asking you, oh allmighty wisdom, because no matter how much i strained to put togehter a deck that could join the discard side, i never felt unbeatable... neither could i keep my def above 6 at all times, neither could i heal 5 hp in each turn as well as discarding from hand and deck at the same time while immidiately removing them from game... and please... enlighten me... which are the cheap cards that i need to obtain to get the unbeatable deck???

guy... get ure stuff straight and keep it real, k? once discard was able to beat everything with a certain ease... i remember panic being banned for 9 weeks in a row... these days are over!!! cards are in the game that go back to deck after being played and each race has its ways to retrieve cards from the graveyard...

stop the nag please

jackal19 · 27-02-2012 09:49:42

to the op: in the times before the discards are near unbeatable but now with the release of some cards that recycle or powerful one shot combos they're not that threatening anymore so (even though i still consider it a bad concept for a 20 card game) all your whines about discard being op is overrated and with your posted knowledge there just proves you don't know much about this game yet learn to use def reducers or just kill the weakest chain in their line up for example abyssien the devourer who is pretty vulnerable to one shots. So stop your whining and just build counters for them or learn to live with them they wont leave ever btw i used to hate em but since i tried em in elo all i can say is they are not the one deck to rule them all they still fail against certain type of decks.

Dernière modification par jackal19 (27-02-2012 11:15:58)

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Annonce

#1 19-02-2012 09:17:05

How to fix discard decks.

#2 19-02-2012 22:34:47

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#3 19-02-2012 22:36:22

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#4 19-02-2012 23:45:40

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#5 19-02-2012 23:55:46

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#6 20-02-2012 08:59:51

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#7 20-02-2012 09:59:15

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#8 20-02-2012 10:49:29

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#9 20-02-2012 11:55:52

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#10 20-02-2012 12:01:13

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#11 20-02-2012 16:55:35

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#12 20-02-2012 18:09:39

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#13 20-02-2012 18:14:25

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#14 21-02-2012 06:02:16

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#15 26-02-2012 05:17:07

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#16 26-02-2012 08:23:46

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#17 26-02-2012 10:46:03

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#18 26-02-2012 17:09:47

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#19 26-02-2012 17:59:47

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#20 26-02-2012 18:31:36

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#21 26-02-2012 18:36:17

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#22 26-02-2012 18:50:13

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#23 26-02-2012 21:56:29

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#24 27-02-2012 00:22:11

Re : How to fix discard decks.

#25 27-02-2012 09:49:42

Re : How to fix discard decks.

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