Theft can be tricky, I often get 1 and that often makes all the difference. I notice the times I do lose is because the player beat me down. Its the people who either stop playing cards or try to hard to overpower. -6atk or -3atk +4 def or +7 def can stop just about anyone. Or my Thefts don't trigger more than 1 vs a low spirit deck.

I won't lie the best strategy I have had to face is a Kotoba guy who did the following.

Turn 1 Iro vs Abyss he playes wakizashi and katana abyss is at 1hp
Turn 2 I pick Kriss vs Asajiro he playes a waki and thats it
Turn 3 Gak vs Salem he plays a perferator

The rest of the game I had to try and mix my milling with surviving as this is one of two situations where not playing cards works. The other being sap hearts(which becomes far more drawn out with my build at least)

Even Noz mage can outrace my mill, if it doesn't mill the big bangers I get blazed up.

Here's what I currently use, its Circus and it wins about 2/3 of the time, it's all about control. Even if I have to outlast upwards to 8 turns I will. Has successfully milled through 2 ANS in one match. This is it's current state I'll note what it would be idealy after.

Salem <> Kriss <> Abyssian
I like all circus because I cannot afford the recycle mill and I have a pet peeve about not having all options available to me with the cards in my hand when I cannot pick who is going to play the turn. Abyssian is very squishy but its pretty obvious when and how u should keep him alive on ***bip*** turn. Typically if they do not have 3 spirit I keep him alive turn 1.

3 - Panic
3 - Theft
3 - Look Away
2 - Treacherous
2 - I hate Brawlers
2 - Cloning
1 - Tadaa You're A Bunny
1 - Fallback
1 - Deliverance
1 - Watcher
1 - Anathematize

Ideally -2 Brawlers +2 Obesity | -1 watcher +1 ANS | -1 Deliverance +1 Anything really
*Ideally Yilith/Eternal/Ish recycle mill lol

Im testing deliverance. Mental Siphon has synergy with Panic but only Abyss can use it. With deliverance I can not only try for a better hand, but potentially theft away w/e they may be holding on to. While I agree Siphon is better, with Abyssian being so squishy it often never got played. This deck is 136-74(67%win rate) some elo some level. I dont use it much after 1650. It is also very inexpensive as is. Tadaa can be replaced with Tempest Fugit. Golemarlok does really well in this deck but again I prefer all 3 Circus Cigue could be used over Kriss as well but I've never bothered to waste the money on him.

I'd also like to note that the win rate is overall. I can guarantee you its win rate is much lower vs players who have solid deck builds and/or strategies. I've faced mill decks of various degrees and only Recycle mill gives me trouble. Ive faced as close to this version of my deck and wiped the floor with it. So really people need to learn how to beat it just like you would learn to beat any other deck.

Dernière modification par Glasher (01-02-2011 17:12:02)

magius · 01-02-2011 18:07:54

What Glasher say is true. Discard decks are horribly bad against fast and furious beat-them-down deck (Temple Guardian, Eclipse, Zil, even Saps sometimes). I can speak from experience .

To be honest, no deck is perfect-against-all-kind of decks (Courtesan came close to that though IMHO).

Dernière modification par magius (01-02-2011 21:03:44)

Ninsane · 02-02-2011 03:32:02

magius a écrit :

What Glasher say is true. Discard decks are horribly bad against fast and furious beat-them-down deck (Temple Guardian, Eclipse, Zil, even Saps sometimes). I can speak from experience .
To be honest, no deck is perfect-against-all-kind of decks (Courtesan came close to that though IMHO).

absolutely true. I play discard deck, and every time I pray that my 3 toons are still alive after turn 3, and the opponent doesn't have [card]A new start[/card]

Dernière modification par Ninsane (02-02-2011 03:32:25)

mist13 · 02-02-2011 05:15:36

magius a écrit :

What Glasher say is true. Discard decks are horribly bad against fast and furious beat-them-down deck (Temple Guardian, Eclipse, Zil, even Saps sometimes). I can speak from experience .
To be honest, no deck is perfect-against-all-kind of decks (Courtesan came close to that though IMHO).

hey! my trackers must be mentioned lol. as long as I go fast beat down and use shuriken like crazy.

magius · 02-02-2011 10:06:11

mist13 a écrit :

magius a écrit :
What Glasher say is true. Discard decks are horribly bad against fast and furious beat-them-down deck (Temple Guardian, Eclipse, Zil, even Saps sometimes). I can speak from experience .
To be honest, no deck is perfect-against-all-kind of decks (Courtesan came close to that though IMHO).
hey! my trackers must be mentioned lol. as long as I go fast beat down and use shuriken like crazy.

Yep... Trackers are a pain when they have their shurikens. However, more often then not, because of their [card]Tracker's Emblem[/card], you got hit the most with [card]Treacherous[/card] . It is dependant if they manage to draw shurikens very early in the game.

Ninsane · 02-02-2011 14:23:43

oh and now there's [card]Hook[/card] he ignores all shadow spells! LOL at my discard deck

chix · 10-02-2011 09:43:26

Glasher a écrit :

Aside from the Yilith/Ish/Eternal recycling mill, its just a race. Just like any other match except you face much more drawbacks if your decisions are not called right.
Theft can be tricky, I often get 1 and that often makes all the difference. I notice the times I do lose is because the player beat me down. Its the people who either stop playing cards or try to hard to overpower. -6atk or -3atk +4 def or +7 def can stop just about anyone. Or my Thefts don't trigger more than 1 vs a low spirit deck.
I won't lie the best strategy I have had to face is a Kotoba guy who did the following.
Turn 1 Iro vs Abyss he playes wakizashi and katana abyss is at 1hp
Turn 2 I pick Kriss vs Asajiro he playes a waki and thats it
Turn 3 Gak vs Salem he plays a perferator
The rest of the game I had to try and mix my milling with surviving as this is one of two situations where not playing cards works. The other being sap hearts(which becomes far more drawn out with my build at least)
Even Noz mage can outrace my mill, if it doesn't mill the big bangers I get blazed up.
Here's what I currently use, its Circus and it wins about 2/3 of the time, it's all about control. Even if I have to outlast upwards to 8 turns I will. Has successfully milled through 2 ANS in one match. This is it's current state I'll note what it would be idealy after.
Salem <> Kriss <> Abyssian
I like all circus because I cannot afford the recycle mill and I have a pet peeve about not having all options available to me with the cards in my hand when I cannot pick who is going to play the turn. Abyssian is very squishy but its pretty obvious when and how u should keep him alive on ***bip*** turn. Typically if they do not have 3 spirit I keep him alive turn 1.
3 - Panic
3 - Theft
3 - Look Away
2 - Treacherous
2 - I hate Brawlers
2 - Cloning
1 - Tadaa You're A Bunny
1 - Fallback
1 - Deliverance
1 - Watcher
1 - Anathematize
Ideally -2 Brawlers +2 Obesity | -1 watcher +1 ANS | -1 Deliverance +1 Anything really
*Ideally Yilith/Eternal/Ish recycle mill lol
Im testing deliverance. Mental Siphon has synergy with Panic but only Abyss can use it. With deliverance I can not only try for a better hand, but potentially theft away w/e they may be holding on to. While I agree Siphon is better, with Abyssian being so squishy it often never got played. This deck is 136-74(67%win rate) some elo some level. I dont use it much after 1650. It is also very inexpensive as is. Tadaa can be replaced with Tempest Fugit. Golemarlok does really well in this deck but again I prefer all 3 Circus Cigue could be used over Kriss as well but I've never bothered to waste the money on him.
I'd also like to note that the win rate is overall. I can guarantee you its win rate is much lower vs players who have solid deck builds and/or strategies. I've faced mill decks of various degrees and only Recycle mill gives me trouble. Ive faced as close to this version of my deck and wiped the floor with it. So really people need to learn how to beat it just like you would learn to beat any other deck.

------

Hello, im fairly new to the game and was wondering who you meant by "Kriss"? Im thinking of trying this discard deck due to lack of crystals, minus Abyssian of course.

Lonak · 10-02-2011 10:17:32

[card]Kriss[/card]: this card

Hope this helped!

Quagmire · 10-02-2011 11:54:57

in addition with that, Kriss can be buy in store. idk if he's in the market.

para · 10-02-2011 18:12:05

Quagmire a écrit :

in addition with that, Kriss can be buy in store. idk if he's in the market.

cards in the store arent available in the market

Wrak · 12-02-2011 13:31:44

This is too unfair for other players. I play with Kotoba, and although I can reach high attack values, they always have good defense cards or ones that lower my attack, what makes impossible to kill them in less than 2-3 turns... In the end, their pontuation is around 1-5 points and they win the match. Staff should do something about it :S

Shocri · 12-02-2011 13:38:03

I agree, it's impossible to play against discard deck.
they always win.
it's unfair, pls it's time to change.

Eredan-Dan · 12-02-2011 13:47:34

lol, it is no where near impossible to beat discard decks. you just have to adapt.

MikeyB · 12-02-2011 15:13:25

Shocri a écrit :

I agree, it's impossible to play against discard deck.
they always win.
it's unfair, pls it's time to change.

i've tried alot of different discard deck builds...they seem to lose just as much as they win...i'm a player who plays with various decks to find a good weakness and using discards, believe it or not, witchblades would slaughter me everytime. the discard zils don't have high spirit scores. the only one who does is marlok the repenant and the new abyssien, but they suffer in the defense dept. (abyssien not so much...but basically, their attack scores were just high enough to trigger ice shields without damaging the girls too much and the girl's spirit scores are low enough to tolerate treacherous.

other than that, eclipse/solarian decks kill discard decks...high attack, high health, constant healing with solaris, low spirit and obesity...discard decks can't touch em...they are pesky decks to battle, but they aren't unbeatable unless you refuse to change up ***bip*** strategy a bit.

All in all the game goes thru trends...from the time i started playing; everyone used trackers and shuriken, then everyone switched to courtesans and manipulation, then came ihas and now discards....those are just the main trends. i also noticed alot of elfine saps with hypnotic melody + quick draw and magic poison; foam giants armed to the teeth with the help of 2 craftsmen; tri witch blades with draconic spells and witchblade cards; high spirit Noz ie pilkim with RoD, BiH and various AoE spells; dragonknights with paladins hammers;.....they are all very powerful decks and all really hard to beat....unless you change ***bip*** deck build with strategies to counter them...

I', not sayin i'm all for discard decks. i would like to see a lot more variety in deck builds. there are much more pertinent issues to gripe about than....i can't beat "this" deck, get rid of it.

para · 12-02-2011 15:29:25

Wrak a écrit :

This is too unfair for other players. I play with Kotoba, and although I can reach high attack values, they always have good defense cards or ones that lower my attack, what makes impossible to kill them in less than 2-3 turns... In the end, their pontuation is around 1-5 points and they win the match. Staff should do something about it :S

if i can beat them with noz mages (not running rod or lb3) then im sure you can manage to beat them as a deck with low spirit. the key? dont play any cards. if you have trouble with that go try out sap heart. ihas or elfines work great against them

Vasillisque · 12-02-2011 16:47:02

wow, the "OP!! OP!!!" just never ends..
"hit hard, hit fast," as someone else already said..if you can't do that then think and plan out your strategy, it's far more useful than begging for feerik to "do something about this",
and to be honest eredan's discard deck is far nicer than other discard decks, like in magic the gathering where two cards can delete your whole deck in one turn..expensive cards yes, but still..

Ergonomic Cat · 12-02-2011 21:28:40

I think the biggest issue is that a discard deck is cheap to build, but anti-discard cards are extremely expensive. ANS and Obesity are the best counters, and they're tremendously expensive. On the other hand, Treachery, Theft and the like are trash cards for a lot of people.

My main issue with discard is that it requires you to completely reshape your deck in case you face it. It's not a "splash 2-3 cards and keep your core strategy" type of thing. You have to look at every deck you have in terms of how it will survive discard, and rip out big sections, which you don't have to do for most other styles.

Additionally, there aren't any anti-discard cards. Most killer decks have built in weaknesses. IHAS is killed by Anath-whatever. Foam Giant gets squashed by Freeze or To Lay Bare. Etc. Discard deck doesn't really care what you play - it's the same cycle of "-attack, discard" every turn.

MikeyB · 12-02-2011 22:08:40

Additionally, there aren't any anti-discard cards. Most killer decks have built in weaknesses. IHAS is killed by Anath-whatever. Foam Giant gets squashed by Freeze or To Lay Bare. Etc. Discard deck doesn't really care what you play - it's the same cycle of "-attack, discard" every turn.
Offline

you can counter with obesity, moneyed, the councils decision, watcher or just plain attacking them with ***bip*** strongest cards...***bip*** not gonna win every time as it also comes down to luck in the draw...i'm currently runnin a buff group with xin, asagi and galmara and was taken out by lvl 2 witchblades EMA (Egalynte, Moira, Anazra). i'm a lvl 16 player, this guy was lvl 12...i didn't take the loss too well. but it goes to show even if you had all the right cards in ***bip*** deck...you can still lose to a bad draw. if you base ***bip*** decks around a core strategy or a single objective ***bip*** gonna lose more often to decks that render ***bip*** strategy useless as well as a draw. suck it up. play a discard deck for a week and see if you win every game you play...there are plenty of players out there who'll destroy a discard deck in 3-4 turns even if they are playing look away etc.
i used galmara, abysien, salem with 2 look aways, 3 manip, a nehantic stone, 2 whips and the rest discard cards and fillers....i lost half as many as i won...just by playing them you realize they aren't all that threatening....unless ***bip*** running high spirit with no spells, in which case ***bip*** just shootin yourself in the foot.

Gabriel_Caetano · 12-02-2011 23:58:18

I have another concept about this thing...

it`s all about style, resources and adaptation

I play more or less the same deck since i began the game ( well, actually the only card i kept from the starter deck is [card]selene[/card] witch became [card]the shadow[/card] back when the [card]dark stone heart[/card] was a cheapo), i liked the concept of the guild, defined my stile of playing and improved the deck.

Of course I spent a few quid in feez to get what i thought i needed, but my deck is not very expensive at all...

And I have a kind of modus operandi, i mean, a basic strategy. But I usually change that way of playing according to my opponent. And as I see new releases and new decks/strategy I change my own deck a bit as well. I have 3 or 4 cards supposed to be "life saviors" for my deck`s weaknesses.

So quit this chit chat about making decks to counter decks. The smartest choice is to chose your stile of playing, gathering resources (when you can) and adapt to new decks and strategies.

Of course most uniques and legendary cards make decks a little harder to deal with, but every deck has strong and weak points and you gotta observe and explore them.

That`s all I have to say about the subject.

Wrak · 13-02-2011 01:04:12

It's unfair because we spend a lots of crystals to build our own deck (I spent 80k only for a Gakyusha The Imperial Lord level 4) and they just buy some discard carts and characters, and that's it, they can win everything...

The Courtesan's Deck is also overpowered...

MikeyB · 13-02-2011 01:22:58

Wrak a écrit :

It's unfair because we spend a lots of crystals to build our own deck (I spent 80k only for a Gakyusha The Imperial Lord level 4) and they just buy some discard carts and characters, and that's it, they can win everything...
The Courtesan's Deck is also overpowered...

lol omg...so any deck tha's cheaper than urs and can beat it is OP!? get serious man...high priced cards are high priced because they hard to come by. nm their effectiveness. my courts have been countered with obesity, awakening and sunburn more times than i can count. what deck are you running? mebbe someone can offer you advice as to what cards you can do without and which cards are a must have in every deck....example: i don't play a deck without anathematize...not just for ihas, but burn in hell and panic are diminished by it as well...and new start is useless. one card and you already countered 4 separate strategies. now you just gotta beat the draw...and unless ***bip*** a hacker, it's all luck. if you are a hacker, may you burn in hell....nah jk but i wouldn't like you very much....

Dernière modification par MikeyB (13-02-2011 01:23:46)

Ninsane · 13-02-2011 02:44:39

Scrappykid, you should try playing a discard deck. It's not simple, requires more thinking, planning, luck, and hope that your opponent doesn't know how to deal with discard deck. The last one is the most important, because if the opponent do know how to beat a discard deck, you'll need the best possible hand in order to win.

It's on my top 3 of most used decks, and it has the least win/loss ratio with 208/59 (the other 2 decks are abomb and witchblade). It's the most tiring to play out of the three, but one of the most fun to play although the most fun deck is armada's pirate deck

Dernière modification par Ninsane (13-02-2011 02:46:21)

MikeyB · 14-02-2011 10:14:17

Armada...sexy, in a tomboy way....also, i hate her.

Eredan's World

Annonce

#1 01-02-2011 15:56:48

Discard decks

#2 01-02-2011 16:33:44

Re : Discard decks

#3 01-02-2011 17:02:10

Re : Discard decks

#4 01-02-2011 18:07:54

Re : Discard decks

#5 02-02-2011 03:32:02

Re : Discard decks

#6 02-02-2011 05:15:36

Re : Discard decks

#7 02-02-2011 10:06:11

Re : Discard decks

#8 02-02-2011 14:23:43

Re : Discard decks

#9 10-02-2011 09:43:26

Re : Discard decks

#10 10-02-2011 10:17:32

Re : Discard decks

#11 10-02-2011 11:54:57

Re : Discard decks

#12 10-02-2011 18:12:05

Re : Discard decks

#13 12-02-2011 13:31:44

Re : Discard decks

#14 12-02-2011 13:38:03

Re : Discard decks

#15 12-02-2011 13:47:34

Re : Discard decks

#16 12-02-2011 15:13:25

Re : Discard decks

#17 12-02-2011 15:29:25

Re : Discard decks

#18 12-02-2011 16:47:02

Re : Discard decks

#19 12-02-2011 21:28:40

Re : Discard decks

#20 12-02-2011 22:08:40

Re : Discard decks

#21 12-02-2011 23:58:18

Re : Discard decks

#22 13-02-2011 01:04:12

Re : Discard decks

#23 13-02-2011 01:22:58

Re : Discard decks

#24 13-02-2011 02:44:39

Re : Discard decks

#25 14-02-2011 10:14:17

Re : Discard decks

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