Just think of what will happen to the community if only one kind of deck and one player always won ELO. this will get boring easily. so by banning cards like the abomination, or other OP cards it will add axcitement as well more interest in deck builds rather than the usual ones that always win in ELO.

this will also help to balance out the market. thanks.

Raeil · 24-01-2011 01:38:12

That would be all well and good. Then every card that could be boosted would be blocked. Abomination would obviously be first, let's see... then Pilkim, Armada, eventually every card would be blocked off.

eydarr · 24-01-2011 01:54:30

artemis_fowl a écrit :

I suggest that every week, the players can vote or the devs can ban cards which they think is too overpowered.
Just think of what will happen to the community if only one kind of deck and one player always won ELO. this will get boring easily. so by banning cards like the abomination, or other OP cards it will add axcitement as well more interest in deck builds rather than the usual ones that always win in ELO.
this will also help to balance out the market. thanks.

what cards would like like to ban? I think the eredan itcg community feel that the more diversity the better as their are more counters available.

artemis_fowl · 24-01-2011 02:54:47

they can just ban cards like abomination like every other week. like they total all the most used cards in that week and that would be the pool for voters to vote on.

so in the next week, the cards that are banned and not mostly used can then again be used in ELO.

then it will also be more diverse. look in MTG, they have banned cards but are still very diverse in gameplay. Yu-gi-oh too has ban cards. this is just about players adopting to the metagame.

im sure this will be more interesting in the eredan comunity rather than seeing one player win the ELO over and over again with just one or two kinds of deck.

para · 24-01-2011 07:15:41

artemis_fowl a écrit :

they can just ban cards like abomination like every other week. like they total all the most used cards in that week and that would be the pool for voters to vote on.
so in the next week, the cards that are banned and not mostly used can then again be used in ELO.
then it will also be more diverse. look in MTG, they have banned cards but are still very diverse in gameplay. Yu-gi-oh too has ban cards. this is just about players adopting to the metagame.
im sure this will be more interesting in the eredan comunity rather than seeing one player win the ELO over and over again with just one or two kinds of deck.

however with Yu-gi-oh you can resell the cards at least for money. if you ban cards in an online game they would be pointless and take up space seeing as you cant resell for money.

steven_allen · 24-01-2011 07:38:09

Just because you lose to something doesnt mean it needs to be banned.

artemis_fowl · 24-01-2011 10:06:09

again, all im saying is to not permanently ban them. im just suggesting to ban them like every other week. plus its the players who plays ELO are the ones who gets to vote on which cards they would like to ban. it wouldn't much affect the market price or make a strong card pointless if one strong card is banned for a week and can be usable again next week, eh?

ELO is all about competitive play, if you want to use your overpowered decks then go to a level room and beat everyone you like.
and im speaking as i have played a lot of online iTCG, and even the good ones and succesful games mostly have banned cards in ELO.

or even just at least control the deck builds if you don't want to ban them.
for example limit the total amount of level of the 3 characters in a deck. this could not possible affect the market or make a card pointless in a way right?infact this will add more interest into deck building for different players. every player should not be controlled by the cards, card games are supposed to be a game of minds too anyway.

its not just me suggesting about improving or balancing decks for ELO anyway.

don't get me wrong, i don't want them to be banned just because i loose a lot to them. im just more concerned into the more competitive gameplay of the game specially in ELO.thats all.:D

Vasillisque · 24-01-2011 15:26:17

please get over the OP'ing comments people..
abomination is strong because you either (like me) worked your ass off since day one of playing the game for days and days and then a few days more to fuse and level him to levels where a won PERFECT match appears as half a thin little old man's hair in the EXP bar OR you paid a bunch of crystals for him. he's strong because you earned it, it's that simple..
the strongest character i have ever faced is ishaia and to this date i have never won a battle in which she is one of my opponents, however i understand that her game starts at 0, low atk, low def and somehow by the end of the battle my abomination, shadow and yilith are either dead or have such low stats it's sad, ishaia's hp is back at it's full and her atk and def are greater than my full stat abomination's..
THAT'S why she's so expensive, i UNDERSTAND that, strong characters have a reason for being so, either they are greatly worked for or they are very rare drops..

Zorak · 24-01-2011 16:28:51

Vasillisque a écrit :

please get over the OP'ing comments people..
abomination is strong because you either (like me) worked your ass off since day one of playing the game for days and days and then a few days more to fuse and level him to levels where a won PERFECT match appears as half a thin little old man's hair in the EXP bar OR you paid a bunch of crystals for him. he's strong because you earned it, it's that simple..
the strongest character i have ever faced is ishaia and to this date i have never won a battle in which she is one of my opponents, however i understand that her game starts at 0, low atk, low def and somehow by the end of the battle my abomination, shadow and yilith are either dead or have such low stats it's sad, ishaia's hp is back at it's full and her atk and def are greater than my full stat abomination's..
THAT'S why she's so expensive, i UNDERSTAND that, strong characters have a reason for being so, either they are greatly worked for or they are very rare drops..

Its not about being OP, Its more like have only 2 or 3 decks that can see the top. That way everybody will aim for the same decks and then what's the point in release new cards every week?
Besides, diversity is a key point to make money in TCG, so I believe that in the future the bans or a total restructuring in ELO mode will occur and if you think carefully about that it still favors that player that invest lots of money and time in the game bc they can have all kinds of decks.

artemis_fowl · 24-01-2011 18:29:11

wow. finally. someone who understands me. thanks zorak.

again, we are not asking for just banning a card or a group of cards. we are just suggesting better ways, mechanics or rules in deck building in ELO to make it more balanced and diversed instead of the same 1 or 2 kind of deck winning in ELO.

Proximus · 24-01-2011 18:47:23

Different tournament formats and weekly new cards are a reasonable way to introduce diversity, not banning cards entirely (not even for a limited amount of time). I liked the approach of the Christmas tourney's restrictions (only l1 chars, banned ultra rares, highlander), this gives you a choice instead of a restriction.

Zorak · 24-01-2011 19:16:31

Proximus a écrit :

Different tournament formats and weekly new cards are a reasonable way to introduce diversity, not banning cards entirely (not even for a limited amount of time). I liked the approach of the Christmas tourney's restrictions (only l1 chars, banned ultra rares, highlander), this gives you a choice instead of a restriction.

Restrictions and bans sounds the same for me. I think most of the people that posted here took the idea in an extreme way. Ban/restrictions are not that simple. Someone wrote in another topic about give points to cards and them limit the ELO room by points. I like this idea. You can use any monster that you got, but must keep the track on your deck points.
Of course, players in the comfortable zone hate this kind of suggestions, and they are right, but I just think that every idea that can favors the brain and not the pocket are always welcome.
They can keep the ELO room like it is right now, just give to us new rooms with different kinds of tournaments and game modes. One day when I have the perfect deck that everyone must have, or a perfect counter to this deck, I go to ELO.
I'm patient. This kind of things take a long time to develop and there's another topics that needs more attention right now.

Vasillisque · 24-01-2011 19:40:54

Proximus a écrit :

Different tournament formats and weekly new cards are a reasonable way to introduce diversity, not banning cards entirely (not even for a limited amount of time). I liked the approach of the Christmas tourney's restrictions (only l1 chars, banned ultra rares, highlander), this gives you a choice instead of a restriction.

exactly. forcing people to change is always going to be something that will be hated by most..
more options, more rooms, more gameplays, yess please. but character bans? it's a spit on the face of those who put precious precious time and money on building their "perfect" deck. i'd feel offended if they were to ban any of my characters..

SMASHistheway · 24-01-2011 19:58:01

Vasillisque a écrit :

Proximus a écrit :
Different tournament formats and weekly new cards are a reasonable way to introduce diversity, not banning cards entirely (not even for a limited amount of time). I liked the approach of the Christmas tourney's restrictions (only l1 chars, banned ultra rares, highlander), this gives you a choice instead of a restriction.
exactly. forcing people to change is always going to be something that will be hated by most..
more options, more rooms, more gameplays, yess please. but character bans? it's a spit on the face of those who put precious precious time and money on building their "perfect" deck. i'd feel offended if they were to ban any of my characters..

Agreed. I used to play ***biiiiipppp*** bip which had a banning system for overpowered cards. However, evolving those cards was FAR easier and it took up barely any time at all compared to Eredan.

Levelling the best cards takes a lot of hard work and that needs to be appreciated instead of having a cry because they're too hard to play against. I don't revel at coming up against Abom and such but it's about concentrating on your own deck and improving it. I have Courtesans but I don't really have the best characters or action cards yet I still maintain a high 60s win percentage.

bleachman · 25-01-2011 04:13:18

Assassination, A Warrior's Fury, Dagger Master Level 3, Life Devourer, Living Dagger, Rain of Death, Fireball, Lightning Bolts Level 3, Than the Sword, The Last Word, The Last Action, The Hungry Void, The Prestige, Quickdraw, Items Have A Soul, Obesity, Solaris, Multitasking, Wakizashi, The Emperor's Speech, Katamaru, Blade of the Witch, A New Start, Divine Light, Solar's Anger, Dragon's Wit, Manipulation, Overwhelming Victory, Burn In Hell, The Best Defense..., Kensensei, Time to die, Storm, Flames of the Phoenix, Fiery Sword, ...

And that is not even starting with characters...

Ban them all please, so meta gaming gains a new look.

Now back to serious business, Prox is right with his words. Certain tourney restrictions is a great way to get around these nasty cards that can literally ruin your gameplay (The fact that you have these cards to your disposal is disregarded at the moment) and add a competative, challenging aspect to gameplay. Banning single cards, as well as letting people VOTE on them, is just silly. Everybody would vote on any of the above mentioned that ruin THEIR OWN strategies, disregarding wether or not their own may be regarded as 'OP' or not. 90% of the people are out there to win, and objectivity and balance is not a word people understand.

jspruill · 26-01-2011 13:36:47

The original poster is asking for something that is (or used to be) similar to ***biiiiipppp*** bip. Every week players can vote on banned certain characters. The top ones get banned for the week in ELO. The game designers choose only the most popular decks and normally choose a key card in those decks. Actually, I think they ban the whole clan. Not sure it has been awhile since I played ***bip***. This allowed diversity and kept one deck archetype from destroying ELO all the time. It allowed for more skill.

Now there was a benefit. Higher ELO players received more votes. so a player that didnt play ANY ELO would only be allowed like 1 vote... a player who focused on ELO and scored well might get 20 votes.

In a deeper explanation, right now lets say in ELO the metagame is Tele, shadow, abom. Other ELO players could ban Zil from ELO for the week. This would allow the metagame to change AND give the developers a look at whats going on. If zil is being banned every other week (the current banned clan can't be banned the following week) and then say pirates is being banned the weeks zil aren't, then they know something is off balance with zil and pirates. If it seems pretty even then they know balance is being achieved.

On top of that, ***bip*** also "retires" cards. These cards be CR or collector. This not only ups the value of the cards (for horders like myself to sell) but also can achieve other bonus':

Able to sell the card for more
Makes the card rare since the longer the game goes on the more people quit and the card becomes increasingly more difficult to obtain.
Not only rare cards become collectors... commons and uncommons can too. (although they only deal with characters this game has multiple "types" of cards)
This also changes the meta game since say, ergue, is a collectors now, this now makes abom cigue and the other one (sorry its early in the am for me and brain isn't functioning yet) a type of collector since they require him.

The important part is that common cards go collector as well... its nice when a card goes collector and you have 10 or 12 of that common card.. its price goes from 100-200 crystals to easily 5000 crystals.

this benefits long term players of the game while still making the cards accessible to new players.

skinnyeddie · 26-01-2011 14:09:51

I kind of like the idea of a weekly vote on what to ban, though I'd prefer a more focused one if possible like specific cards. That way, players can still construct other types of decks from the guild where the banned cards are from.

Having this ensures diversity in the decks that compete. Players may have to spend a bit more to compete every week, but it might not be that big an impact as most ELO players probably have enough cards for several deck builds.

It would also give devs more insight about game balance because they will see which cards get voted frequently, or which combination of cards get voted frequently.

artemis_fowl · 26-01-2011 15:23:48

this is an iTCG people.

if you want something that rewards you if you play too hard, then shift to MMORPG. where every mechanics and the whole sense in grinding is the same. and thats why MMORPG gamers depletes every year. But in this world of iTCG, remember, its supposed to be playing smart, not playing hard.

now what we want is a game that would last for a long time and and would keep our interest. all the haters of the ban or changes in the deck building are saying are short term fullfilment.

balance and competitiveness is not in the vocabulary of the players?what?
card games are supposed to be a competitive game.
maybe now, you may not understand me, but when the time comes that you were so bored to play the game using one or 2 kinds of deck and not winning the ELO even if you have played hard enough. maybe that guy had a point.

Gabriel_Caetano · 26-01-2011 16:52:58

aw boys! what a pointless discussion! if everybody here had 3 living dagger and one foil abomination the topic would be more like "please, give us some real challenge". enough of this crybaby already! some decks are very solid BECAUSE of a few cards, others aren`t that good at all but it`s all a matter of strategy and how much time you spent working on it, figuring out what`s best and if you could spend a few quid on boosters. i`ve been playing this game for half an year now and havent spent more than €40 on it, my deck is not the top elo champion but is pretty competitive and gives me a good time, now if everytime i lost i made a thread to ban OP cards, then MYSELF would be banned from the forum for spamming. wipe your ass and be good losers, coz that`s the way to learn how to be good winners.

Gabriel_Caetano · 26-01-2011 16:56:12

and by the way I agree strongly with new deck formats which are quite fairer and funnier!

skinnyeddie · 27-01-2011 14:31:57

Gabriel_Caetano a écrit :

aw boys! what a pointless discussion! if everybody here had 3 living dagger and one foil abomination the topic would be more like "please, give us some real challenge". enough of this crybaby already! some decks are very solid BECAUSE of a few cards, others aren`t that good at all but it`s all a matter of strategy and how much time you spent working on it, figuring out what`s best and if you could spend a few quid on boosters. i`ve been playing this game for half an year now and havent spent more than €40 on it, my deck is not the top elo champion but is pretty competitive and gives me a good time, now if everytime i lost i made a thread to ban OP cards, then MYSELF would be banned from the forum for spamming. wipe your ass and be good losers, coz that`s the way to learn how to be good winners.

I read my post again and I guess I missed pointing out that the ban that was originally suggested was not permanent but only in effect for a week. It's more of a data gathering tool than anything, but it also encourages varied deck builds on the side.

What such a system can also provide is more reliable evidence that some cards are unbalanced, because we all know that any player who makes a post that some card is OP will automatically be dismissed as a sore loser who is just griping because the deck he made that he thought was unbeatable was pounded by some combo of some other deck. They aren't reliable sources of information about OP, but that doesn't dismiss the possibility of some card really being OP or exploitable, especially for a TCG in it's toddler years. I mean, M:TG and Yu-Gi-Oh had to deal with it several times. Card game designers make mistakes sometimes.

MikeyB · 28-01-2011 00:04:08

steven_allen a écrit :

Just because you lose to something doesnt mean it needs to be banned.

agreed. i enjoy the challenge that powerful decks present. if i won all the time i'd get bored easily. finding new ways and building decks to defeat current "trend" decks is becoming my specialty. tho, to spin off the idea as alot of ppl are using similar decks...mebbe bring in a guild specific lobby? one lobby, elo based and character specific, the guild changes weekly so one week ***bip*** restricted to mercs, the next sap and so and so forth. no courtesans allowed. not as a bias, my main deck is a courtesan deck...and if i ever get my hands i on ishaia i won't have much to fear from abomb...then the discard decks would become a challenge all over again...but i digress. back to the subject...banning cards isn't a good idea. adding more cards is. try building a deck that exploits ***bip*** nemisis' weaknesses while covering ***bip*** own. the strategic possibilities are already endless and banning cards would change this to a fancy game of high card wins. sorry bout the length of my entry...LOT'S of coffee today...

MikeyB · 28-01-2011 00:12:24

artemis_fowl a écrit :

this is an iTCG people.
if you want something that rewards you if you play too hard, then shift to MMORPG. where every mechanics and the whole sense in grinding is the same. and thats why MMORPG gamers depletes every year. But in this world of iTCG, remember, its supposed to be playing smart, not playing hard.
now what we want is a game that would last for a long time and and would keep our interest. all the haters of the ban or changes in the deck building are saying are short term fullfilment.
balance and competitiveness is not in the vocabulary of the players?what?
card games are supposed to be a competitive game.
maybe now, you may not understand me, but when the time comes that you were so bored to play the game using one or 2 kinds of deck and not winning the ELO even if you have played hard enough. maybe that guy had a point.

agreed. tho i would like to see the decks expanded to say...25-30 cards and some traps thrown in. this isn't yugi oh, but being able to play facedowns adds another level of strategy and would balance the game immensely. not that it's seriously unbalanced, but i feel for noobs. whether it be level rooms or elo or even tournaments...a level 8 player is hard pressed to beat the deck of a level 16 player. especially one who enjoys pounding those decks and killing the competitive spirit of someone of low level.

Yugimonz · 28-01-2011 00:35:35

Zorak a écrit :

Vasillisque a écrit :
please get over the OP'ing comments people..
abomination is strong because you either (like me) worked your ass off since day one of playing the game for days and days and then a few days more to fuse and level him to levels where a won PERFECT match appears as half a thin little old man's hair in the EXP bar OR you paid a bunch of crystals for him. he's strong because you earned it, it's that simple..
the strongest character i have ever faced is ishaia and to this date i have never won a battle in which she is one of my opponents, however i understand that her game starts at 0, low atk, low def and somehow by the end of the battle my abomination, shadow and yilith are either dead or have such low stats it's sad, ishaia's hp is back at it's full and her atk and def are greater than my full stat abomination's..
THAT'S why she's so expensive, i UNDERSTAND that, strong characters have a reason for being so, either they are greatly worked for or they are very rare drops..
Its not about being OP, Its more like have only 2 or 3 decks that can see the top. That way everybody will aim for the same decks and then what's the point in release new cards every week?
Besides, diversity is a key point to make money in TCG, so I believe that in the future the bans or a total restructuring in ELO mode will occur and if you think carefully about that it still favors that player that invest lots of money and time in the game bc they can have all kinds of decks.

Ok i do elo rooms all the time each week:
Top decks: In oreder of highest ranking down
Merc Preist(Stone Eater Lady yilith and eternal)
Craft Courts discard( Jorus'or any crafts that you wont to benefit from its craft items',Ish, eternal'or other craft')
Saps (Keizen,Melis,Arrow chick)
Courts Discard (Ish,Eternal,lord gal or salem)
Noz mage (Pilk aero pro)
Crafts(Foam,Ramen,Jorus)
Noz courts (Erev,Ish,Pilk)
Zill (Abom,Tele,Shadow) <----- Notice way down here

Now there is diversity in this game although it might be small it's there:)
Saps
Crafts

MikeyB · 28-01-2011 01:39:58

Ok i do elo rooms all the time each week:
Top decks: In oreder of highest ranking down
Merc Preist(Stone Eater Lady yilith and eternal)
Craft Courts discard( Jorus'or any crafts that you wont to benefit from its craft items',Ish, eternal'or other craft')
Saps (Keizen,Melis,Arrow chick)
Courts Discard (Ish,Eternal,lord gal or salem)
Noz mage (Pilk aero pro)
Crafts(Foam,Ramen,Jorus)
Noz courts (Erev,Ish,Pilk)
Zill (Abom,Tele,Shadow) <----- Notice way down here
Now there is diversity in this game although it might be small it's there:)
Saps
Crafts

I play elo rooms as well and i've yet to even face those decks...and craft decks are hard to master...if someone can do well with tri-craftsman i give em kudos. but as i mentioned before...the decks that are winning become "trend" decks. basically, someone recognizes a decks dominative potential and decides to use it to...so you can build a deck to counter "popular" decks, with ***bip*** own weaknesses in mind and keeping certain strong cards in mind, such as ihas. the idea is the more you play, the stronger ***bip*** deck stragtegy becomes and in effect ***bip*** deck...if you can't win by any other means than to vote out the strongest eventually you'll fall victim to ***bip*** own devices. climb the ladder like everyone else. you win some you lose some...you can't win them all. i don't think there is a single player in eredan that has a 90% or higher win rate. i'd have to look more closely at players in the 75-80% realm too. i'm sure there are those out there but inless they've played thousands of games i'd think something was afoot. ...which btw when you face such unbeatable decks, check the players profile to see how many games he/she has played to give you an idea of the amount of time they invested to acquire their deck...you may not be as far behind the curve as you think. now if we can only do something about evo grinding....hahahaha ok ok not revisiting that issue.

Eredan's World

Annonce

#1 24-01-2011 01:16:41

Ban Cards

#2 24-01-2011 01:38:12

Re : Ban Cards

#3 24-01-2011 01:54:30

Re : Ban Cards

#4 24-01-2011 02:54:47

Re : Ban Cards

#5 24-01-2011 07:15:41

Re : Ban Cards

#6 24-01-2011 07:38:09

Re : Ban Cards

#7 24-01-2011 10:06:09

Re : Ban Cards

#8 24-01-2011 15:26:17

Re : Ban Cards

#9 24-01-2011 16:28:51

Re : Ban Cards

#10 24-01-2011 18:29:11

Re : Ban Cards

#11 24-01-2011 18:47:23

Re : Ban Cards

#12 24-01-2011 19:16:31

Re : Ban Cards

#13 24-01-2011 19:40:54

Re : Ban Cards

#14 24-01-2011 19:58:01

Re : Ban Cards

#15 25-01-2011 04:13:18

Re : Ban Cards

#16 26-01-2011 13:36:47

Re : Ban Cards

#17 26-01-2011 14:09:51

Re : Ban Cards

#18 26-01-2011 15:23:48

Re : Ban Cards

#19 26-01-2011 16:52:58

Re : Ban Cards

#20 26-01-2011 16:56:12

Re : Ban Cards

#21 27-01-2011 14:31:57

Re : Ban Cards

#22 28-01-2011 00:04:08

Re : Ban Cards

#23 28-01-2011 00:12:24

Re : Ban Cards

#24 28-01-2011 00:35:35

Re : Ban Cards

#25 28-01-2011 01:39:58

Re : Ban Cards

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