I agree it is hard to keep up and get the good stuff you want without using such methods or spending Feez. I still think people shouldn't need to use such flawed mechanics to be able to do that though. Especially since this grinding method goes against the purpose of what the mechanic abused is actually meant to do.

Feerik needs to fix the 3er drop out system and in addition add some more fair and bearable ways to level characters and other cards.

Squarta · 05-12-2010 13:16:06

The goal Feerik needs to obtain is a system where levelling your characters is funny.If I play with my brand new deck at level 15 against a trio of only level 3 characters,i can't entertain me while playing.This is a point.

Another question is the crystal's one,where people prefer to grinding (and grinding is not funny,for anyone) than normally playing to obtain money.But this question involves other aspects of the game and the discussion is surely wider;i.e. there are no other solution to make money.Tournaments?Yeah but with the actual formula they exclude a lot of decks to be played.Elo?If you succeed in finding players to challenge,you will obtain an HUGE prize of 4k crystals.I can't buy a single fireball winning 6 (Six!) Elo tournaments...

Dernière modification par Squarta (05-12-2010 13:16:47)

goscar · 05-12-2010 17:03:22

I guess if it becomes too abuseable it would be best to take away that failsafe so people cant abuse it.

I also agree that there should be a better way to get crystals.

Dernière modification par goscar (05-12-2010 17:04:09)

Anihilate · 05-12-2010 20:44:35

Well, instead of focusing on the 3 and out method, They should actually focus on improving the legitimate game techniques. The way things are set, if you can't obtain feez, and you don't 3 and out, the game is not entertaining at all.

-Give training rooms the ability to do what they are meant for: TRAIN CARDS, it does absolutely nothing for most, because even though people can't bring in maxed characters, there are still level 3's, even level 4's that can go into the room. 5 extra xp a day is NOT cutting it when your character's have the experience jumps of:
Level 1-2:160
Level 2-3:320
Level 3-4:640
Level 4-5:1280
It's seriously discouraging to level a decent deck when you can't win and have no other way to obtain exp.
Fix: Give more exp per game, do not let the deck in if it has ANY max level cards, AND give more games a day or just give unlimited access.

-Give more crystals per win/loss: Lets face it, the chances of getting a card you want are MINUSCULE in any of the packs available, you get 20 crystals per loss, 40 crystals per win, and 70 crystals per perfect. Uncommon cards can range from 2,000 to 30,000 on the market, and the only other place you can spend them is in the store for the other two starter decks. So when you buy a booster, chances you'll get something worth a decent amount of crystals are slim, further than that, you get less than a pat on the back for winning games.
Fix: At LEAST double the output you get from games.

-Tournaments: You get 10k for winning, too bad if you don't have a metagame deck you aren't even placing. You need a metagame deck to win a tournament to get the crystals you would need to get a metagame deck... makes perfect sense. And Amnezy is a joke. You bust your ass playing against top tier players to get 4,000 crystals and a card you'll probably never use. YAY! The hourly tourneys have a small set list of people who constantly win, especially when you compare it to the amount of registered users.
FIX:There are MANY suggestions of how to fix this game mode. The best out of them, in my opinion, is to have it as the following
Registration stays open leaving the tournament with 64 registration slots. When one tourney is full, it starts IMMEDIATELY, and it is SINGLE ELIMINATION.
When one Tourney is full, Registration opens for another.
This way there is a set amount of matches in each tourny, the best man wins, and there are multiple tournaments at a single time(if there are enough registered) AND with this you can only be in 1 tournament out of the several ones open.

-Feez: People are paying the same amount of money on this digital game,per pack, as they would on a real life card game. Makes sense./sarcasm

Take the time to fix the reason WHY people have to 3 and out before you fix the mechanic.
If the game works in a fair way, people won't HAVE to exploit,and this discussion wouldn't be necessary because NO ONE WOULD CARE if you limited who they played against in a row.

goscar · 05-12-2010 20:58:31

Anihilate a écrit :

Well, instead of focusing on the 3 and out method, They should actually focus on improving the legitimate game techniques. The way things are set, if you can't obtain feez, and you don't 3 and out, the game is not entertaining at all.

Hmm I knew about this method and never used it.... and my LV4 PILKIM, LV3 WITCHBLADE AND LV 3 ZAHAL are winning me games now. >_>
Way I see it the failsafe was suppose to be there in case of an accident not for abusing. Like I said before if this keeps being abused just take out the failsafe.

But I will state this, game needs a better crystal reward system.

Anihilate · 05-12-2010 21:35:13

goscar a écrit :

Anihilate a écrit :
Well, instead of focusing on the 3 and out method, They should actually focus on improving the legitimate game techniques. The way things are set, if you can't obtain feez, and you don't 3 and out, the game is not entertaining at all.
Hmm I knew about this method and never used it.... and my LV4 PILKIM, LV3 WITCHBLADE AND LV 3 ZAHAL are winning me games now. >_>
Way I see it the failsafe was suppose to be there in case of an accident not for abusing. Like I said before if this keeps being abused just take out the failsafe.
But I will state this, game needs a better crystal reward system.

What level are you? Many of the people here are 16+

steven_allen · 05-12-2010 21:39:09

You act like Feerik doesn't know about this. The top level French players all do it. And they have for a long time. Go to the French side of the forum and tell Ulf, SDD, Izzy, Entelechy or any of the others to stop doing it.

bleachman · 06-12-2010 10:42:38

I have removed useless posts of people bickering at and attacking eachother. We are having a civilised and well mannered conversation here. Please refrain from making it lousy.

MikeyB · 20-01-2011 10:43:51

He makes a valid argument. however, i'm opposed to any kind of boosting or abusive play styles. i think it's underhanded and ruins the game for those who play straight up. i believe the issue is not so much with those who do this with a partner, but the way it slants against ppl who respect fairplay. But i suppose ppl are just different. some cut corners and others take more pride in doing things "the right way".

Poptolev · 20-01-2011 11:32:06

1. Those who play "straight up" are scrubs. If you don't know what a scrub is - google it

2. Fairplay is playing by the rules. If someone manages to find me a rule section in the game ... then you can accuse people for breaking them.
I've spent hours searching for such a section and I couldn't find it. So good luck with it.

3. You'd assume that if the developers haven't done anything about it in the last months ... and the lack of rules - it's legal and they don't have anything against it despite their posts against it.

Yugimonz · 20-01-2011 16:51:00

Just throwing this out there sense feerik has decided to increase xp permanently. Because the three drop system is Still there. Most characters have just been reduced so much it makes it new player friendly have the ability to buy them at a better price.Now i know some other cards cost have doubled and tripled.This is because there becoming limited due to this first series being so freaking massive so buying packs nets you less now days so more cards become limited and so people sell them higher. Of course there are people that just sell high but ignoring them everyone else is going to sell them at a higher rate as there is less out there.

The reason i say this is because maybe feerik did listen and they tried to deal with it. But seems to be worse off now evoing takes 50% less time.

MikeyB · 20-01-2011 17:59:41

Poptolev a écrit :

1. Those who play "straight up" are scrubs. If you don't know what a scrub is - google it
2. Fairplay is playing by the rules. If someone manages to find me a rule section in the game ... then you can accuse people for breaking them.
I've spent hours searching for such a section and I couldn't find it. So good luck with it.
3. You'd assume that if the developers haven't done anything about it in the last months ... and the lack of rules - it's legal and they don't have anything against it despite their posts against it.

i play straight up and i still manage to give "boosters" a run for their money with the decks i've evolved by simply playing the legitimate matches. I've never known about this kind of levelling until a couple days ago and now that i know, i have much less respect for higher level players. cuz, you can't exactly tell who used it or didn't. The developers haven't changed it, because the mechanic is in place for a reason. Removing it because players abuse it would be punishing legitimate players for something so-called "scrubs" aren't even aware of (for the most part). It's just poor gaming behavior and displays a serious lack of respect for the game.

just to draw from a similar boosting method that disrupts a gaming community, the term "boosters" is one i draw from modern warfare 2 players. without going into great length of describing the game...the tactic boosters use is to partner up with someone, enter a battle, find a corner and start killing each other to boost xp and unlock perks and achievements. there aren't enough bad words to describe how i feel about players like that (not to mention, even the mild ones aren't allowed in the forum) but, this method of levelling in eredan is the same thing. to me, THOSE are the scrubs since they have to "cheat" to level their cards rather than earn the rewards for levilling them legitimately.

since the developers can't readily determine each and every abuser, if it were up to me, i would ban anyone who IS caught doing it in order maintain the integrity of the game. but this is just my opinion. i'm sure boosters like it about as much as i like their play style.

Poptolev · 20-01-2011 18:44:39

(I've bolded the most important parts)

I will rephrase myself
Who do you think you are judging the way the other people play a rule-less* game ?

*until someone actually shows me the rule section in-game I will thread it as an anarchy based game with any kind of playing (botting, using 3rd party software to gain advantage etc.) allowed.

EDIT: Refresh your knowledge about scrubs. The above example has nothing to do with scrubs. Scrubs limit themselves believing they are playing "the right" way trashing everything else which is not banned by a normal gaming community. You thinking it's cheating has little to no value. If it's not forbidden (by the rules) then it's allowed, so the people playing in the corner for achievements are not cheating. They are playing by every writen rule.

TBH I am on the other side - I cannot express with words my feelings towards people like you, limiting themselves thinking there is some sort of a moral that everyone should follow. Even IRL the laws are writen following the morals (or theoretically they should be, politologics/politics 101) and if something is not forbidden by the laws then it's generally accepted as moral (with few local variations, where something is accepted as moral somewhere but it's not accepted as moral elsewhere). So if something is not mentioned in the game's rules than it has to be accepted as moral or as you'd say "the right way to play" and should not be frowned by "fair-players" (most of which can't even touch competitive ground because of their limits).

There were few suggestions (one of them was mine) that would work better than the current system ... I will rephrase a well known quote "If it's broken there is no reason to keep it/not fix it".

Dernière modification par Poptolev (20-01-2011 19:00:51)

goscar · 20-01-2011 19:57:30

LOL at Poptolev and his hardcore gaming face......
Either way, only thing to say to his post is: If there were no laws against killing others will it be morally acceptable to do so?

Now back to the real topic this the fail safe really has no purpose now that we are getting more exp.

Poptolev · 20-01-2011 20:05:03

goscar a écrit :

Either way, only thing to say to his post is: If there were no laws against killing others will it be morally acceptable to do so?

Believe me if there weren't any legal consequences for killing 2/3 of my country would already be killed ... by me.

goscar · 20-01-2011 20:06:44

Not what I ask......

Poptolev · 20-01-2011 20:10:14

goscar a écrit :

Not what I ask......

Ooook I suppose I should answer the question then. Moral is made by the weak and if the number of people who can take care of themselves is bigger than the number of weaklings => the ratio will change and the majority will be with the first => it would be morally right to kill whoever you want. (To remove that clause from the laws/conventions you'd need majority anyways)

Dernière modification par Poptolev (20-01-2011 20:14:42)

goscar · 20-01-2011 20:30:09

Here I did what you couldn't do...
http://forum.eredan.com/viewtopic.php?i … at=itcg-us

TOS read up!

* exploit, distribute or publicly inform other members of any game error, miscue or bug which gives an unintended advantage

Poptolev · 20-01-2011 20:32:12

Half of the job is done ... now they have to add it ingame ... or at least a link that redirects to the forum.

Hmm sooo botting is illegal but I fail to find anything about the leveling abuse simple because it's not a bug* abuse or anything similar (the above quote is irrelevant in the second case).

*The system is coded that way (and there are penalties for misusing it ... the lack of penalties for .. misusing the penalties system is another problem)

Dernière modification par Poptolev (20-01-2011 20:36:37)

MikeyB · 20-01-2011 20:49:28

laws and morals are not the same. just as a lock is only meant to keep honest ppl honest. it's not very christian of me, but, i would question ***bip*** grasp of moral fiber and principals when you play with such underhanded tactics. But my post wasn't an attack directed at you but toward that particular playstyle. for all i know you're pretty decent individual, i just think that play style sucks in every definition of the word. i really don't have an opinion about you specifically or anyone else who plays that way other than...the way you exploit and abuse a system set in place to compensate ppl in the event of an unfortunate occurence is, to say the least, distasteful. you shouldn't take it personally. i could see it being a personal offense if you lived and breathed eredan, but then if that were the case, you prolly wouldn't play that way. simply put, there are ppl who disagree with ***bip*** methods and other players who use them. I am one of those. Not judging you, i just don't like ***bip*** methods and if it were my game...you wouldn't play unless you decided you could play it the way it was meant to be played. (...naturally, the argument would be i'd lose alot of players, but those wouldn't be the kind of players i'd be catering to anyway)

goscar · 20-01-2011 20:57:54

Mikey your wall hurt my eyes..... and I read it all.

Either way lets not go into a whole moral issue debate here the TOS clearly in my quoted part talks about it, so yeah....

MikeyB · 20-01-2011 21:01:09

Poptolev a écrit :

goscar a écrit :
Not what I ask......
Ooook I suppose I should answer the question then. Moral is made by the weak and if the number of people who can take care of themselves is bigger than the number of weaklings => the ratio will change and the majority will be with the first => it would be morally right to kill whoever you want. (To remove that clause from the laws/conventions you'd need majority anyways)

ppl who operate by morals or principals aren't weak. quite the opposite as they do not cut corners or find the easy out. it is not morally right in anyway to kill whomever you want or are you saying child rapists/murders are morally sound ppl and those who don't understand them are weaklings? c'mon tha's a bit extreme. not to mention heading off topic. but ***bip*** reasoning behind implementing such tactics is making less and less sense with each statement. why not just say "hey, it's easier. it's faster. I get an unfair advantage over other players and take great joy out of destroying noob decks and don't really care what anyone else thinks." -that would be honest and express ***bip*** actual attitude, instead of making such ludicrous judgements of those who would rather see a game tha's fair and even across the board. where a veteran can can lose to a noob through dumb luck or skill or a combination of the two.

MikeyB · 20-01-2011 21:03:23

goscar a écrit :

Mikey your wall hurt my eyes..... and I read it all.
Either way lets not go into a whole moral issue debate here the TOS clearly in my quoted part talks about it, so yeah....

sorry, was tryin to avoid it and redirect the convo back to the issue at hand...i believe the question was "do players find this method of levelling bothersome and should there be something done about it?" ya can guess where i'd cast my vote....

Poptolev · 20-01-2011 21:07:43

MikeyB a écrit :

laws and morals are not the same.

I stopped reading here (I wont waste my time reading the other wall of random gyberish). I've never said they are the same, the laws are based on the morals. Simples.

Dang ... I couldn't just pass by it ...

There is nothing wrong with "cutting corners to find an easier way". Sir, the computer you're using ATM (I assume you're not using iPod) was invented because people are lazy. There are two major forces driving the evolution of human beings and they are laziness and boredom (they are pretty much connected but not separate so I had to mention them both). I can't think of an invention that wasn't invented because people are lazy in general or because someone was bored. Every single invention that helps your daily activities is invented because people are lazy to do work themselves.

"Yeah you know I don't like to use the washing machine but that lazy ass next door is cheating! You know she cuts corners and wants the easy way using something I don't like to do the work for her so she can do things faster! It's sooooo unfair" (I know ... a bad example)

And just fyi it's not an unfair advantage. It would be unfair if only few selected could do it. You limiting your self is the problem. If you want you can play the same way and have the same benefits.

Again the problem is not with their style of play but with your attitude. Just because you don't like it and it gives better benefits it doesn't mean that it's wrong. It's pretty much like saying that playing Noz Mages/Zilz is cheating because most of the top players are using them, you don't like them and they have a better win rate.

(actually I am not abusing the system, simply because I play 3-4 games per day for fun with other people playing for fun, but I AM NOT DISSING another playstyle simply because it can give me more benefits)

And please .. please:
1 - Use google translate/google in general to check your spelling
2 - Separate your text in paragraphs
My grammar and spelling might not be tier 1 but I simply cannot take you seriously with that writing style.

Dernière modification par Poptolev (20-01-2011 21:19:47)

MikeyB · 20-01-2011 21:20:22

we're just two ppl with opposed opinions. i'm not gonna try and convince you that urs is wrong just like you won't convince me to adopt ***bip*** methods....just because all the best players are doing it. i think it's wrong. period.

Eredan's World

Annonce

#26 05-12-2010 09:21:03

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#27 05-12-2010 13:16:06

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#28 05-12-2010 17:03:22

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#29 05-12-2010 20:44:35

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#30 05-12-2010 20:58:31

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#31 05-12-2010 21:35:13

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#32 05-12-2010 21:39:09

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#33 06-12-2010 10:42:38

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#34 20-01-2011 10:43:51

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#35 20-01-2011 11:32:06

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#36 20-01-2011 16:51:00

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#37 20-01-2011 17:59:41

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#38 20-01-2011 18:44:39

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#39 20-01-2011 19:57:30

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#40 20-01-2011 20:05:03

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#41 20-01-2011 20:06:44

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#42 20-01-2011 20:10:14

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#43 20-01-2011 20:30:09

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#44 20-01-2011 20:32:12

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#45 20-01-2011 20:49:28

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#46 20-01-2011 20:57:54

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#47 20-01-2011 21:01:09

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#48 20-01-2011 21:03:23

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#49 20-01-2011 21:07:43

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

#50 20-01-2011 21:20:22

Re : Limiting 3 in, 3 out Leveling abuse.

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