Politikas a écrit :
There is a permament removal card, you just have to be lv 25 to get it Door to nothingness if i remember corectly.
Wait a minute. If I'm not mistaken Door will NOT remove cards previously attached. I seem to recall that during the beta-testing it only removed the cards played during the turn it's played.

Ack... so in the end nothing we can do against permanent then? I guess I'll keep on decking myself if against a fully-levelled courtesan deck (with Councillor)

bleachman · 12-10-2010 18:21:33

Hmmm all of the awesome court cards are action cards... I wonder which card could get rid of those...

[card]Obesity[/card]

magius · 12-10-2010 19:11:36

bleachman a écrit :

Hmmm all of the awesome court cards are action cards... I wonder which card could get rid of those...
[card]Obesity[/card]

Unfortunately, you need to have to start the turn in order to use that isn't it?

Apart from that, it only 'ignores' the action? Does that include permanent actions?

I might understand the card wrongly

JarodG64 · 12-10-2010 20:30:47

You're right. Obesity only counters the card coming after it's played and you can only have 3 in your deck whereas there are more than 3 useful court action cards and some can be chained.

To tell the truth french players are asking for a new card allowing to get rid of a card already attached to a character. Something like Smash the iron.

bleachman · 13-10-2010 03:25:12

Even if you are not first in the turn sequence, you can still cancel out a second action card played, which tends to happen often in some court decks.

The only really powerful card courts has is manipulation, as it has no draw back and is damn useful. Council's Order is okayish, though I personally dislike the 2 HP drawback as it tends to hurt me more often than it does the opponent.

JarodG64 · 13-10-2010 04:05:41

You forget the tea thing card which is also a real pain in the...

bleachman · 13-10-2010 05:20:02

It is a strong card but not THAT powerful.

Plus that card is more or less easier to nuke than manip.

Politikas · 13-10-2010 09:31:35

Good mage deck laughts at manipulation, maybe its time for mages to come back?

Luxo2011 · 13-10-2010 09:34:04

Politikas a écrit :

Good mage deck laughts at manipulation, maybe its time for mages to come back?

For mages, there are enough slots in the deck to put things in against mages

magius · 13-10-2010 10:27:12

Politikas a écrit :

Good mage deck laughts at manipulation, maybe its time for mages to come back?

Don't forget about [card]Philosophical Debate[/card]. I think Courtesan is well-rounded, albeit a bit TOO well rounded. You have to remember they have mage-based Courtesans too and ability to pump up their Spirit levels. Mages will have hard time against the Courtesans simply because of the Spirit pumps.

Courtesan's Health loss ability (their signature move) is powerful due to lack of defense against it except through Theurgy healing. By the time you lose your health, warrior-based Courtesans will bash their damage through.

bleachman · 13-10-2010 11:32:10

magius a écrit :

Politikas a écrit :
Good mage deck laughts at manipulation, maybe its time for mages to come back?
Don't forget about [card]Philosophical Debate[/card]. I think Courtesan is well-rounded, albeit a bit TOO well rounded. You have to remember they have mage-based Courtesans too and ability to pump up their Spirit levels. Mages will have hard time against the Courtesans simply because of the Spirit pumps.
Courtesan's Health loss ability (their signature move) is powerful due to lack of defense against it except through Theurgy healing. By the time you lose your health, warrior-based Courtesans will bash their damage through.

There are two full mage courts, one being the bomb the other being moderate only as it rapes your otehr char's spirit as well. They still are not even remotely capable in catching up with Noz mages.

Tea Ceremony is great, but the problem is you still need to use it. So a warrior that uses Tea Ceremony will have to refrain from using any other powerful cards, same goes to marauder based ones too.

Politikas · 13-10-2010 13:30:08

Good courtesan deck needs Kimiko, Hasna and maybe the new councilor, but thats up for debate, but if you loose even one of those in first 3 rounds (very easy vs full Noz mage deck with prophet and 5 spirit all around), you are in trouble. Loss of even one char is lethal for courts who live by buffing each other.

SlyTechs · 13-10-2010 23:10:32

you guys should stop arguing about the obvious spirit thing...courtesans have Overwhelming victories, manioulations...which heal kimiko, boost all your stats...thats without counting the Watcher card, bringing back any action from the grave to the deck...and thats like 1/3 of the deck right there...no items yet, and even with not fully evo chars, its owns...true, its expensive to make, but tell me what can beat it except maybe mages...kotoba defense is a joke comapred to theirs, attack from Zils is also a joke if you let them equip those permanents...and their defense is going up to like 8-9....and they hardly deckout...i mean, as a tracker deck, with all the defense stacking, hp regain, spirit stacking...and hp gain...i still cant even kill one of those heroes...cuz dealing NO damage doesnt help...at all, while you slowly get pummeled by the -2 from kimiko, and galmara or Oogoe...Freeze is good for items, but i havent seen no cards for permanent removals...i see courtesans swarming top tier decks...they will probably release perma removals, but for now...u gotta pray realll hard for them to get a really bad hand...and even then, you gotta OS asap, or its just over

Martenus · 14-10-2010 09:15:15

jepp thats the only balanceing problem i see there is no way to deal with Permanent cards.

Luxo2011 · 14-10-2010 09:24:03

SlyTechs a écrit :

you gotta OS asap, or its just over

that's often the case in ELO you know? If you seen abomination in front of a courtisan on turn 1... i would bet on Abomination...

Martenus · 14-10-2010 10:24:40

Seduction Potion , Manipulation or something like that even with time to die and an Abo you will not kill it !

bleachman · 14-10-2010 11:06:42

You could just pull a 1st Initiative level 4 Pilkim with Prophet and RoD² the opponent's ass to death.

Courts are in early game really weak to mages. As well as anything else.

Worse case scenario Abomb would be a 8/13 after TTD and Abomination if the court deck pulls some heavy anti artillary. Still decent chances.

Another suggestion is, why not use a court here or there yourself? Use their advantages to yours as well. You can rape their Spirit, their attack, direct damage them. There are plenty of Courtesans out there that you can manhandle into some deck of yours. I really do not see why they need a nerf.

I myself run a pretty decent Courtesan deck (not using tea ceremony and direct damage) and always have trouble against mages or heavy equipped warrior decks (such as Dragon Knights) and general Nomads/Mercenary decks.

magius · 14-10-2010 11:22:19

bleachman a écrit :

You could just pull a 1st Initiative level 4 Pilkim with Prophet and RoD² the opponent's ass to death.
Courts are in early game really weak to mages. As well as anything else.
Worse case scenario Abomb would be a 8/13 after TTD and Abomination if the court deck pulls some heavy anti artillary. Still decent chances.
Another suggestion is, why not use a court here or there yourself? Use their advantages to yours as well. You can rape their Spirit, their attack, direct damage them. There are plenty of Courtesans out there that you can manhandle into some deck of yours. I really do not see why they need a nerf.
I myself run a pretty decent Courtesan deck (not using tea ceremony and direct damage) and always have trouble against mages or heavy equipped warrior decks (such as Dragon Knights) and general Nomads/Mercenary decks.

I don't think they need a nerf either, I believe courtesan has its unique strength and it would be a shame to penalize them simply because they have loads of answers to other kind of decks.

I just think about the game-balance in form of permanent actions/spells. Courtesan has ridiculous permanent (*cough* manipulation *cough*) that has no drawback.

What we need is a permanent action or permanent spell removal. Even mage deck that utilises Ice Barrier/Static Charge, a permanent spell removal can also be a game balancing element.

How many permanent removal cards you want to put into your deck is up to you, the more permanent removal cards, the more watered down your deck would be. That is the way it is isn't it? (similarly to Freeze and Smash the Wall).

EDIT: Come to think about it, 'Freeze' version of permanent removal might be too powerful. 'Smash the Wall' version of it would be more balanced IMHO.

Dernière modification par magius (14-10-2010 12:00:20)

Rathedan · 14-10-2010 13:35:38

Come to think about it, 'Freeze' version of permanent removal might be too powerful. 'Smash the Wall' version of it would be more balanced IMHO.

This probably should be something considered soon.

Not just for the courtesans, but in general, there is a lot more permanent cards coming into play that could use some form of General countering. DK decks using Solars anger (theres no killing a 16/16 DK with a Pally hammer....), Courts, Ice Barriers, Nomads using under the sun....Permanents are becoming more prominent than when the initial counter cards came out, probably wouldn't hurt to add a permanent, single-removal card like smash.

Villacqua · 15-10-2010 01:28:19

Is there a place where I can see all the Eredan cards?

I'm asking because I'm also working on a deck that can beat the courtesans (since there aren't all their cards to get in the marketplace, or they are too expensive to get kkkkk), but many cards that you are mentioning in this topic (like Freeze) that I have never seen in action or in the marketplace.

Also, if anyone can provide a regular decklist for the courtesan deck, would be nice.

Dernière modification par Villacqua (15-10-2010 01:33:08)

SlyTechs · 15-10-2010 02:44:09

regular courtesan deck has 3 overwhelming victory, 3 manipulation, 2-3 under the sun maybe, Watcher, to get back versatility or some other action cards, Tadaaa! and Kimiko, Galmara, 3rd hero, u choose, the new legendary i hear is very good with courts...so yea, they stack permanents, debuffing you, they buff themselves and, slowly kill ya, while u try killing them, by hitting 2-3 damage...at least thats what my tracker deck did...decked out, 1 hero left with 3hp...opponent had all lv 1 heroes, i had lv 3...all his were alive with at least 6-7 hp left...soo yeah, it was...harsh...cuz my tracker deck has 80% win rate with not even the Life devourers and keep your guard up...but even then, i doubt i could of won...

Eredan's World

Annonce

#1 12-10-2010 09:45:03

Courtesan overpowered?

#2 12-10-2010 10:28:37

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#3 12-10-2010 10:49:52

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#4 12-10-2010 11:06:43

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#5 12-10-2010 11:34:44

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#6 12-10-2010 18:21:33

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#7 12-10-2010 19:11:36

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#8 12-10-2010 20:30:47

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#9 13-10-2010 03:25:12

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#10 13-10-2010 04:05:41

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#11 13-10-2010 05:20:02

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#12 13-10-2010 09:31:35

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#13 13-10-2010 09:34:04

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#14 13-10-2010 10:27:12

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#15 13-10-2010 11:32:10

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#16 13-10-2010 13:30:08

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#17 13-10-2010 23:10:32

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#18 14-10-2010 09:15:15

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#19 14-10-2010 09:24:03

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#20 14-10-2010 10:24:40

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#21 14-10-2010 11:06:42

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#22 14-10-2010 11:22:19

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#23 14-10-2010 13:35:38

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#24 15-10-2010 01:28:19

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

#25 15-10-2010 02:44:09

Re : Courtesan overpowered?

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